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Understanding "-us"

de Soma N., 2011-aprilo-08

Mesaĝoj: 9

Lingvo: English

Soma N. (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 12:32:20

I was having a discussion with someone, and he used the phrase "Mi ne scius."

What does this mean? And what does the "-us" suffix mean? The Vortaro says it's a "(conditional mood marker)," and my brief search on Google has led me to believe that as a non-grammarian the "-us" suffix currently eludes me.

Chainy (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 12:38:03

Mi ne scius = I wouldn't know.

Se mi scius la respondon, mi dirus al vi = If I knew the answer, I would tell you.

Note that in the Esperanto version you use '-us' in both parts of the sentence, rather than the slightly bizarre usage of the past tense in the first part of the English sentence (knew).

Soma N. (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 14:34:01

Chainy:Mi ne scius = I wouldn't know.

Se mi scius la respondon, mi dirus al vi = If I knew the answer, I would tell you.

Note that in the Esperanto version you use '-us' in both parts of the sentence, rather than the slightly bizarre usage of the past tense in the first part of the English sentence (knew).
But what does "I wouldn't know." mean? Wouldn't the proper thing to say be "I don't know."?

Is "Mi ne scius" something without a real translation in English?

What does "(conditional mood marker)" mean?

Chainy (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 14:40:44

Soma N.:But what does "I wouldn't know." mean?
Is English a foreign language for you?

Soma N.:
What does "(conditional mood marker)" mean?
It's all about sentences which typically contain the words 'if' and 'would'.

Mi irAs = I go
Mi irUs = I would go.

3rdblade (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 14:50:37

Soma N.:But what does "I wouldn't know." mean? Wouldn't the proper thing to say be "I don't know."?

Is "Mi ne scius" something without a real translation in English?

What does "(conditional mood marker)" mean?
'I wouldn't know' is an English form usually meaning 'I don't know.' We often do things like that to soften the blow of our words. But it doesn't mean the same in EO. You might use it in something like this - "I don't know about cars. If you taught me how to how to drive a car, I wouldn't know how to fix it."

Conditional Mood Marker: '-us' is a marker which gives the verb a conditional mood. In other words there is a condition attached to it, and it's very often 'se' (if), as in my example above, which I will now attempt to esperantify:

Mi ne scias pri aŭtoj. Se vi instruis min kiel veturigas aŭton, mi ne scius kiel povas rebonigi ĝin.

tommjames (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 15:16:58

3rdblade:Mi ne scias pri aŭtoj. Se vi instruis min kiel veturigas aŭton, mi ne scius kiel povas rebonigi ĝin.
Don't be thrown off by English's use of the past tense form "taught" for the conditional. As per Chainy's message, Esperanto doesn't work that way; you use -US on both parts of the sentence.

A better translation would be "Se vi instruus min [kiel] veturigi aŭton, mi ne scipovus rebonigi ĝin"

Soma N. (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 15:32:10

3rdblade:But it doesn't mean the same in EO.
This is what I was getting at. English is the only language I speak, but the construct "I wouldn't know," while familiar, seems invalid when scrutinized.

Translating such a thing into (or from) Esperanto gave me pause.

Chainy (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 16:06:09

Soma N.:
3rdblade:But it doesn't mean the same in EO.
This is what I was getting at. English is the only language I speak, but the construct "I wouldn't know," while familiar, seems invalid when scrutinized.

Translating such a thing into (or from) Esperanto gave me pause.
You'll have to give us more info about the context in which the person said 'mi ne scius' and then we'll be able make some sense of it.

Context is kind of important in this case.

erinja (Montri la profilon) 2011-aprilo-08 16:15:18

In English, "I wouldn't know" is usually used in situations when not only do I not know, but in my opinion, I have no way of knowing.

I say "I wouldn't know" when I am the wrong person to ask. Someone else would know the answer to this question, but I wouldn't. Iu scius la respondon, sed mi ne scius.

"I wouldn't know" can be an honest and polite answer, but it can also be somewhat mocking. "Are you kidding, do you really think that I would know the answer to this question?"

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