Gender Neutrality...
de Kalantir, 2011-oktobro-15
Mesaĝoj: 162
Lingvo: English
Maverynthia (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 14:15:11
Kalantir:How come everyone hasn't begun using it? Is there a valid reason not to?There's really no valid reason that I can see other than a resitance to being "too PC".
Even the people that are "Well we have vir-" and that's good enough, when it's not. It IS inconsistent and trying to say it's not is just silly.
Esperanto genders things with a suffix and it's gendered female (the other, not the default). It's similar to the way in English everything is perceived male by default unless it's something that traditionally is 'for women' or "Female X" or "Woman X". For example when talking about unspecified animals or even children, people will use "he, him" over "it; they, them". So gendering using -icx is far easier and more consistent than vir-.
It could even be argued that even the vir- prefix and -in suffix is sexist based on the fact that "man" comes before and "woman" comes after.
Honestly I just see the people arguing AGAINST -icx wanting to cling onto sexist ideals and trying to argue that "male default words hurt no one" when.. yes they do. It makes the language look pretty sexist and even a bit misogynistic.
I would just keep using -icx and ignore anyone who thinks it's wrong. Be the change you want to see kind of thing.
Miland (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 14:32:01
It is better to learn Esperanto as it is, rather than make it into something one would like it to be. This applies especially to beginners.
lgg (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 17:09:33
Miland:It is better to learn Esperanto as it is, rather than make it into something one would like it to be.Apparently, it's not. Most people see Esperanto like some ridiculous crap, not a language for future international communication. Of course these 'not-beginner' esperantists will blame anything for that megafail than themselves and their academy puppetmasters. For them, Esperanto is perfect, and of course it's an international conspiracy that in the age of Internet the number of speakers is less than in 20th century.
robinast (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 17:40:12
darkweasel (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 17:42:07
lgg:Most people see Esperanto like some ridiculous crap, not a language for future international communication.Yes, and then they (you) troll a forum dedicated to learning the language they see as some ridiculous crap. With things that have been discussed over 9000 times. Google with site:en.lernu.net/komunikado/forumo is your friend.
lgg:in the age of Internet the number of speakers is less than in 20th century.Source???
Miland (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-23 20:48:45
"If you .. learn the language as it is, instead of guessing what it might be, and refrain from suggesting improvements till you have learned it (and discover that the points you once criticized .. are just those which stamp Esperanto as the creation of a genius) - then your progress will be speedy and certain."
I would say: we should learn the language as it is, not only that we might make progress, but that it might - since the alternative is a fragmentation into sects, none of which has had as much success as Esperanto.
lgg (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-24 13:27:53
Miland:...and discover that the points you once criticized ... are just those which stamp Esperanto as the creation of a geniusDear Miland, could you personally explain, how assymmetric forming of neutral/masculine/feminine form of nouns, or strange (and unique) letters in its akphabet exactly are 'creation of genius'? I doubt it.
Miland (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-24 14:12:11
lgg:Dear Miland..I doubt it.Dear lgg, That's quite all right - I wasn't writing with you in mind.
lgg (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-24 14:57:56
Miland:Dear lgg, That's quite all right...Thought so. Don't make a sect out of language.Don't recite mantras. It's rather stupid and counterproductive.
lgg (Montri la profilon) 2011-decembro-24 15:07:38
robinast:Dear Igg, is exactly what you want - Esperanto plubonigita...Why would anyone need many different Esperanto shards? Until Esperanto bonzos won't get some sense, dump cult mentality and accept all the positive changes into Esperanto? Esperanto may as well lay down and die, if it content with 2 000 000 (with statistical manipulation) speakers.
Come on, these Academy clowns even have 'Fundament' on their site, Russian translation is... with yers and yats!! In 2012!! How can anyone think about competing with English while having such idiocy wherever you step?