Translating Idioms into Esperanto
viết bởi nissimb, Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
Tin nhắn: 11
Nội dung: English
nissimb (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 09:52:20 Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
I am just a beginner in Esperanto, and I am just getting a "feel" of Esperanto culture, including its original and translated literature. But I have one doubt: When you translate literature from various languages into Esperanto, how do you translate the various idioms in that language into Esperanto? In case of translation between two natural languages, the obvious solution is to use idioms in the target language that are closest in nuance and meaning to the idiom in the source language. But since Esperanto does not have "original" idioms, what does the translator do? Although it is possible to literally translate idioms such as "it rained cats and dogs" into Esperanto, people from different cultures are not going to understand its meaning. So how do Esperanto translators overcome this "idiomatic" barrier?
ceigered (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 13:24:46 Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
Idioms are basically made up on the spot, but often are very unidiomatic so everyone gets it, or we translate literally with a footnote. It's a hard thing to balance, but it's the same when translating between any two languages I guess!
sudanglo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 13:46:18 Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
However, if it is felt that the idiom will be opaque in a wider (global) setting, then the meaning of the idiom has to be translated. This can be done in plain language, or a more readily comprehensible image may be used.
For example, to translate 'it was raining cats and dogs' you might say 'pluvegis' or you might use a more colourful reference, like 'la pluvo falis torente', or 'ni droniĝis sub la pluvo' or 'la ĉielo verŝis sian enhavon senkompate sur nin'.
It is a characteristic of Esperanto (for obvious reasons) that it avoids idioms that might not be understood internationally, but many metaphors can be assumed to be recognizable across cultures - for example 'fulmo-rapide', 'nebulaj pensoj'.
Furthemore, some comparisons can be readily understood from context even if they are not sanctioned by usage.
If I said 'li dancas kiel urso', it would not be too difficult to understand in context that this meant peze kaj mallerte rather than the opposite.
erinja (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 13:55:07 Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
But Esperanto does have some native idioms. They're found in the Proverbaro, which, contrary to its name, does not contain only proverbs, but also idioms. It was written by the creator of Esperanto, in order to ensure that Esperanto would have a collection of its own idioms and proverbs, as other languages have.
Most of the idioms and proverbs aren't widely used, so you might not hear of them a lot. But they are mostly easy to understand, regardless of your language background.
For example, the Esperanto version of "It's Greek to me" is "Tio estas por mi volapukaĵo" ("It's Volapuk to me"). The Esperanto version of words falling on deaf ears is "prediki al surduloj" [to preach to the deaf]
Your knowledge or capability has been exhausted - "Venis fino al mia latino" ("An end has come to my Latin")
Some of the things in the proverbaro are just small turns of phrase, suggestions of how to say something. So we have "vivi emerite" (to live as a retired person), which isn't really any special kind of idiom. Another example is "Kia domaĝo!" ("What a shame!")
sudanglo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 14:09:57 Ngày 23 tháng 11 năm 2011
If I need to translate 'cool as a cucumber' from English to another national language I have to use the appropriate comparable idiom of the target language - which might be as cool as a cabbage or something else.
In order to keep the learning load light and in recognition of its function as an international auxiliary language, Esperanto shuns such idioms.
The principle is the expression of meaning more directly, though this doesn't mean that you can't be colourful.
There are many characteristics of Esperanto which are not shared by the national languages, extreme regularity for one, and another is the avoidance of the tyranny of usage.
A tyranny which has as a consequence that in a national language you can sound distinctly odd by using a particular form (of many equally logical possibilities) which happens not to be the one favoured by the native speakers.
nissimbedekar (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 12:37:52 Ngày 26 tháng 11 năm 2011
robbkvasnak (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 21:56:16 Ngày 28 tháng 11 năm 2011
Chainy (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 22:01:16 Ngày 28 tháng 11 năm 2011
robbkvasnak:The only word I am still looking for (and maybe someone from GB can help me out, here) is "rather" as used in GB. In the US we don't use it quite that way. Any colorful ideas to make it sound more "British"?You don't use it what way? It could be handy to give some context.
robbkvasnak (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 23:12:04 Ngày 28 tháng 11 năm 2011
Speaker 2: "Rather!" (with rising tone). [Maybe something like having the meaning "indeed"]
sudanglo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 11:01:55 Ngày 29 tháng 11 năm 2011
For alternatives, none of which to my ears are particularly British:
Absolute!
Vi ne malpravas!
Tute, ĉu ne? (John Wells once said to me that the excessive use of question tags was typical of British Esperantists)
Jes, feliĉega! (contrasting with Ŝi estas tre feliĉa/tre kontenta hodiaŭ)
Take your pick.