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A little knowledge is a dangerous thing!

של rajomishoro, 9 בפברואר 2012

הודעות: 9

שפה: English

rajomishoro (הצגת פרופיל) 9 בפברואר 2012, 00:35:46

Saluton Amikoj!
An Urgent matter has come up.
My little knowledge has hurt one of my Esperntist friends.

Let me explain you.....
Today i posted something on my wall.
One of my english-speaking friends pointed out grammatical errors in my post.

Anne, my Esperentist friend, wrote in English,though she does not know it.

She mentioned that English was a very difficult language and it should be replaced with Esperanto.
Since I love English more than my mother tongue, I became a Little angry with her and posted something in My broken Esperanto.
I posted:
Saluton Anne!
Mi amkaux lernas Esperanton.
Mi pensas ke gxi estas nedeca
loko por reklamo el Esperanton.
mi neamas gxi.
Ragx Misxra.

Now she is hurt and asking me why I dont love Esperanto.
By "mi neamas gxi" I meant, I tried to mean, I did not like your advertising esperanto there"

the matter has became really complicated so I want to explain her that What i meant.
I am ready to apologize to her.

Please write something in Esperanto assuming you were I, I dont want to loose her.

Please write for the sake of my friendship with her.
I will copy-paste it.

Regards.

RiotNrrd (הצגת פרופיל) 9 בפברואר 2012, 02:47:53

Perhaps something like this?

Mi bedaŭras mian Esperantan mallertecon. Mi ne deziris diri ke mi neamas Esperanton. Vere, mi amas Esperanton. Anstataŭe, mi deziris diri ke mi ne volas havi Esperantan reklamon tie.

I regret my lack of skill with Esperanto. I didn't mean to say that I don't love Esperanto. Truly, I love Esperanto. Instead, I meant to say that I didn't want to have an Esperanto advertisement there.

hebda999 (הצגת פרופיל) 9 בפברואר 2012, 06:14:50

rajomishoro:She mentioned that English was a very difficult language and it should be replaced with Esperanto.
She is right, but it is not English that should be replaced, but its role as the international language which is very lame at the moment.

goli (הצגת פרופיל) 9 בפברואר 2012, 10:08:02

Well, English is difficult, but, for example, French is more difficult, then Polish or Russian are much more difficult. Well, Russian I've known since my birth, so I never struggle using it ridulo.gif

And your mistake is caused not by being unexperienced at esperanto. It's just a mistake. If you've said it in English, it might've been ambiguous and misunderstood, too.

I think that it's inappropriate place for advertising Esperanto. I don't like it. (But, of course, you'd better say 'to advertise')

So if you see that the sentence might be ambiguous, just write the exact name of the thing you mean instead of 'ĝi(n)' or 'it'. Sometimes pronouns are dangerous. Use them carefully in order to make everyone clearly understand what you meant to say.

erinja (הצגת פרופיל) 9 בפברואר 2012, 12:56:40

It's too late to take back your first words, but here is an explanation that might help you avoid a similar mistake next time.

The English word "it" is a pronoun that we can use to replace a noun. ("I see a dog. It is brown" it = a dog). We also use "it" to replace a phrase or a verb ("I went to the fair with my sister. It was fun" it = going to the fair with my sister; "I slept for a long time. It was restful" it = to sleep)

The Esperanto word "ĝi" is much more limited. "Ĝi" is a pronoun, meaning it refers to a noun. That is the *only* meaning of "ĝi". We do not use it in the second sense that I mentioned above, replacing a verb or a phrase.

If you want to refer to a verb or a phrase, "tio" is the right word.

Your friend misunderstood your sentence because you used "ĝi" in a place where "tio" was expected. You needed "tio" to refer to "advertising in this place", a phrase. But you used "ĝi" instead - it refers only to a noun, not to a phrase. It was logical for your friend to assume that the noun was "Esperanto", from the context of your sentence.

Here is your original text, edited so that it says what you wanted it to say. You can learn for next time!

Saluton Anne!
Ankaux mi lernas Esperanton.
Mi pensas ke ĉi tie estas maltaŭga loko por reklamado de Esperanto. [OR: loko por reklami Esperanton] Mi ne ŝatas tion.
Ragx Misxra.

--

I changed "maldeca" to "maltaŭga". "Maltaŭga" means unsuitable. The Esperanto word "maldeca" is quite strong, and if you say that something a friend does is "maldeca", it's an insult; it's like calling someone rude.

Mustelvulpo (הצגת פרופיל) 10 בפברואר 2012, 03:45:06

It's interesting that the title of your post is one of the most common misquotes in English. I think that knowledge is rarely dangerous. The correct word is "learning" not "knowledge." From Alexander Pope's Essay on Criticism:

A little learning is a dangerous thing
Drink deep or taste not the Pierian spring
There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain
While drinking larely sobers us again

(In Greek mythology, the Pierian spring is a source of knowledge of art and science and of inspiration.)

This has indeed been a learning experience for you and you won't make the same mistake in the future. Remind your friend of another quote from Pope: To err is human, to forgive, divine.

rajomishoro (הצגת פרופיל) 10 בפברואר 2012, 11:23:24

erinja:It's too late to take back your first words, but here is an explanation that might help you avoid a similar mistake next time.

The English word "it" is a pronoun that we can use to replace a noun. ("I see a dog. It is brown" it = a dog). We also use "it" to replace a phrase or a verb ("I went to the fair with my sister. It was fun" it = going to the fair with my sister; "I slept for a long time. It was restful" it = to sleep)

The Esperanto word "ĝi" is much more limited. "Ĝi" is a pronoun, meaning it refers to a noun. That is the *only* meaning of "ĝi". We do not use it in the second sense that I mentioned above, replacing a verb or a phrase.

If you want to refer to a verb or a phrase, "tio" is the right word.

Your friend misunderstood your sentence because you used "ĝi" in a place where "tio" was expected. You needed "tio" to refer to "advertising in this place", a phrase. But you used "ĝi" instead - it refers only to a noun, not to a phrase. It was logical for your friend to assume that the noun was "Esperanto", from the context of your sentence.

Here is your original text, edited so that it says what you wanted it to say. You can learn for next time!

Saluton Anne!
Ankaux mi lernas Esperanton.
Mi pensas ke ĉi tie estas maltaŭga loko por reklamado de Esperanto. [OR: loko por reklami Esperanton] Mi ne ŝatas tion.
Ragx Misxra.

--

I changed "maldeca" to "maltaŭga". "Maltaŭga" means unsuitable. The Esperanto word "maldeca" is quite strong, and if you say that something a friend does is "maldeca", it's an insult; it's like calling someone rude.
Thanks Erina!
Thank you very much for help and support.

rajomishoro (הצגת פרופיל) 10 בפברואר 2012, 11:29:17

Mustelvulpo:It's interesting that the title of your post is one of the most common misquotes in English. I think that knowledge is rarely dangerous. The correct word is "learning" not "knowledge." From Alexander Pope's Essay on Criticism:

A little learning is a dangerous thing
Drink deep or taste not the Pierian spring
There shallow draughts intoxicate the brain
While drinking larely sobers us again

(In Greek mythology, the Pierian spring is a source of knowledge of art and science and of inspiration.)

This has indeed been a learning experience for you and you won't make the same mistake in the future. Remind your friend of another quote from Pope: To err is human, to forgive, divine.
Thanks!
I will take care of my language from now onward.
I am really learning here something precious!

rajomishoro (הצגת פרופיל) 10 בפברואר 2012, 11:31:14

RiotNrrd:Perhaps something like this?

Mi bedaŭras mian Esperantan mallertecon. Mi ne deziris diri ke mi neamas Esperanton. Vere, mi amas Esperanton. Anstataŭe, mi deziris diri ke mi ne volas havi Esperantan reklamon tie.

I regret my lack of skill with Esperanto. I didn't mean to say that I don't love Esperanto. Truly, I love Esperanto. Instead, I meant to say that I didn't want to have an Esperanto advertisement there.
Thanks a lot!

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