creedelambard:If I ever have $1,000,000,000 to devote to such a cause I might just do exactly that, and throw in a nightly newscast in Esperanto to go with it. There are worse ratholes to throw money into.

If only Soros was our Murdoch, or Ribello was a more adept businessman...

Maybe we should make a thread on this, an Esperanto online TV channel.

I know that this thread has started to die, but I finally had the time to sit down and read through all six pages, and would like to say a few things.

Although I do not yet speak Esperanto fluently, I'm quickly learning and am very passionate about it's idea.. like many Esperantists, it is a dream of mine that it becomes a truely universal language. That being said, I consider myself pretty entrepreneurial, and through just being at the right time at the right place, I'm well acquainted with a man who used to be a C level executive (I can't recall if it was CFO or COO) of what is now known as Honewell (the security systems). He retired, got bored and now works for a government funded company that is essentially a free service to consult with small business owners. In my musings (and well before I read this thread) I sent him an email, explaining what Esperanto is, what it's ideals are and how he might go about promoting it.

He of course said it would be incredibly difficult, but if he were to promote it, he would make a sort of "cult" (although that's not a great word for it), like how Apple made iEverything, and how Apple marketed in general. He also said that he would make some "pop culture" type things, like literature, art, etc. So, I guess what I'm getting at here is, coming from someone who was in charge of a billion dollar company, and seeing how you all came up with pretty much the same ideas, I think we're well on track.

That being said, I also agree with literature and TV shows. One thing I remember seeing a long time ago was "Pasporto Al La Tuta Mondo." While a decent educational series, the over all acting and production is obviously low budget. Not slamming them of course, but I wonder if we could (being a college student) get the help of colleges to produce something excellent for relatively cheap.

On a slightly different topic, as I said I consider myself entrepreneurial, and a sort of pipe dream of mine is to one day set up a sort of non-profit organization dedicated to creating such propaganga (again, not a good term but you get the point) to advocate the spread of Esperanto. I wonder (because I honestly don't know) if anything like this already exists? I'm aware of things such as AdE and UEA, but I don't believe they're doing the same sort of thing.

At any rate, this has turned into a long wall of text, and I apologize for my ramblings. Like I said, I just wanted to throw my naive two cents into it.

Bemused:Find the Beatles, or the Abba, or the Michael Jackson of the current era.
Convince them, by whatever means, to put out an album of work entirely and exclusively in Eo, with a clause forbidding translation to any other language.
People will flock to learn the language, because they have a reason to.

I personally think this would be a great way to get people interested in a language. I love foreign music even if i don't understand a word of it, but most people are not that way. Plus, with the simplicity of the rules of Esperanto compared to "natural" languages, I feel that once people took a look at the language once, it would almost be addicting in a way.

Does anyone else get what I mean by that?

Find the Beatles, or the Abba, or the Michael Jackson of the current era.
Convince them, by whatever means, to put out an album of work entirely and exclusively in Eo, with a clause forbidding translation to any other language.

But it's not the artists who have the power, it's the record companies. If the record company doesn't think it's going to make them money, they won't pursue it. The best chance of EO music getting traction would be from an independent group. And this is true of most reasons why au(x)illiary languages don't get off the ground: the decision to adopt them must be economically motivated.

ok, I've just skimmed this thread, but I have to say that the idea that record companies control the music business is less true now than at any point since the introduction of printed sheet music and/or player piano rolls.

Increasingly, performers and audiences are finding each other through the social network scene: Pandora, YouTube, Facebook, etc. The idea of finding/funding a high-quality musical group and promoting them like crazy on the web sounds fine to me. Let people stream the songs, give away a cut or two for free via digital download, etc. In order to buy the "full album" though (whether on CD or via digital download) requires the user to "click here" and push out that $15 "donation" via PayPal.

I'm pushing 50 myself, so I'm a little out of touch with most of the music of the younger generation is into--but I have a fascination with the "steampunk" genre of music (where I'm outside of the typical age demo by a good 25 years, I'm sure). Those steampunk groups that I'm into? All discovered via social network. Each one led to the next. And while most of those groups do release via CD, they mostly seem to self-press, without a record contract.

I've tried listening to a lot of the more popular Esperanto groups. Most of them don't do that much for me. They're all kind of folk music-y, which is generally not where my musical interests lie. A steampunk Esperanto group would be awesome though (and somehow, Esperanto sorta feels like an appropriate language for a steampunk group to me...). Anything that has a little bit more of an "edge" to it, would probably be a better angle to play on this "soft power" concept.

The idea of winning by influencing the culture rather than by didactic methodology is great, btw...

Mike:The idea of winning by influencing the culture rather than by didactic methodology is great, btw...

We owe this to Antonio Gramsci, and his concept of "cultural hegemony". Truth be told, I deeply hate the guy and his ideology, but then, he's useful.

As far as doing actual things goes, I sort of want to ask this guy if he'd like his comic translated into Eo: http://www.abominable.cc/

It's already available in 7 other languages...I'd be surprised if he said no, haha. Would anyone be willing to help me make a translation if he agrees?

Mike:I've tried listening to a lot of the more popular Esperanto groups. Most of them don't do that much for me. They're all kind of folk music-y, which is generally not where my musical interests lie. A steampunk Esperanto group would be awesome though (and somehow, Esperanto sorta feels like an appropriate language for a steampunk group to me...). Anything that has a little bit more of an "edge" to it, would probably be a better angle to play on this "soft power" concept.

I've never even heard of steampunk music.

I would definitely not say that Esperanto groups are "all" kind of folk musicy, though. I like the group Kaj Tiel Plu, which is definitely folk musicy, in the very true sense (folk songs from the Iberian peninsula, ranging from Renaissance times to the Spanish civil war). But I also like the newer Dolchamar stuff, which isn't folksy at all, and bands like Persone, which is rock (though the sound quality sounds like a garage band - things have improved in Esperanto music recording since Persone was popular), and like Martin kaj la Talpoj. Kore does a very good cover of Queen's "The show must go on". There's Esperanto rock and rap, not folky at all, and some of it is firmly in the "screaming unintelligible things" genre of music. I think the Esperanto rap is pretty bad but I think all rap is pretty bad, so I'm not really qualified to judge the quality of the Esperanto stuff.

...and even Esperanto adaptations of folk songs are not necessarily folky at all.

However, it's true that folk type songs are popular in Esperanto. Part of this is a vestige of Soviet culture; in Soviet times, Esperanto meetings in Russia were often based around camping, so campfire type songs in Esperanto were popular, and we have many original Esperanto songs, and Esperanto translations of classic Russian and Western campfire songs, courtesy of this tradition. Even today, at large Esperanto gatherings, it is very common for someone to whip out a guitar and start playing, and people gather around and start singing together.

I would be tempted to say that another reason for the popularity of folk songs is that the words tend to be very clearly pronounced, when sung by one or two people with a simple guitar accompaniment. It's a lot easier to understand than a song accompanied by crashing guitars or some complicated background arrangement. In a community based around learning the language as a second language, who want to practice by hearing something they can understand clearly, I think the ability to understand the words clearly takes on increased importance.

I was at a concert at an Esperanto event and people were getting up and dancing. My friend said to me, "Esperanto speakers are like little kids, they're dance to anything!". I'd be tempted to add, they'd also sing along to anything.

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I don't really see Esperanto's music industry ever becoming very visible to the non-Esperanto world. People can understand and enjoy steampunk music (for example) even if they have nothing to do with steampunk culture because they can understand it. Lots of people aren't that interested in listening to music that they can't understand at all. Most English speakers don't even have one foreign-language CD in their collections. And most people, even if they like a song, aren't willing to learn a whole new language just to understand it better. Most people would be happy with a written translation at best.

I think that pop music would be suitable for Esperanto. It would certainly appeal to a wider audience.

How does one define Steam punk Music, seems to me that it must somehow involve Victorian culture and invoke both futuristic and Classical imagery and Ideas.

Oh, I like steam punk music. My favorite band is Steam Powered Giraffe (:

But I love folk music, so I'm glad it's popular in Esperantujo.