Berichten: 10
Taal: English
smonkey (Profiel tonen) 6 januari 2013 20:15:08
Similes-
The candle smells like a lilac.
La kandelo bonodoras tiel siringo.
-Is this the correct way to say that?
-Is it better to turn siringo into an adverb or an adjective?
Metaphors-
The store was a circus during christmas.
La vendejo estis cirko dum kristnasko.
- Or would you rather turn cirko into an adverb or an adjective?
acdibble (Profiel tonen) 6 januari 2013 20:38:07
smonkey:Do they function the same as in english?I would say "La kandelo odoras kiel siringo." "bonodori" means "to smell good". So the translation of your sentence would be "The candle smells good like a lilac does.", which doesn't necessarily imply that it has the same odor as a lilac, if I'm not being overly analytical. But you shouldn't use an adverb or adjective. "this candle smells like a lilac (smells)." "lilac" is a noun in both languages. If you wanted to use an adverd, you could say, "La kandelo odoras siringe." With an adjective, "La kandelo havas siringan odoron."
Similes-
The candle smells like a lilac.
La kandelo bonodoras tiel siringo.
-Is this the correct way to say that?
-Is it better to turn siringo into an adverb or an adjective?
Metaphors-
The store was a circus during christmas.
La vendejo estis cirko dum kristnasko.
- Or would you rather turn cirko into an adverb or an adjective?
For the second sentence, I wouldn't say it in Esperanto. I think it may be too idiomatic in English to be carried over. Unless the store literally became a circus, I wouldn't say it.
RiotNrrd (Profiel tonen) 6 januari 2013 20:39:48
smonkey:La kandelo bonodoras tiel siringo.La kandelo bonodoras KIEL siringo.
"Kiel" means "like, as". "Tiel" means "thus", which (thus) doesn't work in this context.
As far as metaphors go, they behave just as in English.
But be conscious of confusing metaphors for idioms. Many idioms are basically common metaphors that "everyone already understands", and whose explanations therefore usually get left out. But in culturally-neutral Esperantujo we can't expect anyone to understand our metaphors without explanation, so always make 'em explicit (as you did in your example; I'm just being pedantic here, not criticizing).
RiotNrrd (Profiel tonen) 6 januari 2013 21:07:55
If you really wanted to underscore that the store became LIKE a circus rather than becoming a literal circus (which most contexts would rule out anyway), you could say La vendejo estis cirka dum kristnasko. Adjectives can describe "like" qualities. Or just explicitly use "kiel" - La vendejo estis kiel cirko dum kristnasko.
Actually, adverbs aren't out of the question here, either. La vendejo estis cirke dum kristnasko also does work. Although, admittedly, I probably wouldn't choose that particular mode of expression here. It sounds a bit strange to my ears.
Or even, if you want to get even more creative, verbify it as La vendejo cirkiĝis dum kristnasko. I'd throw the -iĝ in there just to clarify the meaning; an unmodified "cirkis", I think, is a little murky. If you want to imply that it happened every year, you could shorten it even further to La vendejo cirkiĝis kristnaske.
sudanglo (Profiel tonen) 7 januari 2013 10:58:18
The store was a circus during ChristmasIs this a translation of a German idiom? I don't recognize it as a natural metaphor in English.
I assume the meaning is:
La magazeno svarmis de aĉetontoj je Kristnasko
bartlett22183 (Profiel tonen) 7 januari 2013 17:45:32
sudanglo:Here in the USA most of us would probably recognize it as a metaphor, even if those in the UK or other parts of the anglophone world might not. I agree with your esperantization as apt. However, I would be more likely to say that the store was a zoo (believe it or not).The store was a circus during ChristmasIs this a translation of a German idiom? I don't recognize it as a natural metaphor in English.
I assume the meaning is:
La magazeno svarmis de aĉetontoj je Kristnasko
Simon Pure (Profiel tonen) 11 januari 2013 23:46:10
bartlett22183:Zoo for stores, circus for workplaces (klaŭnoj).
Here in the USA most of us would probably recognize it as a metaphor, even if those in the UK or other parts of the anglophone world might not. I agree with your esperantization as apt. However, I would be more likely to say that the store was a zoo (believe it or not).
sudanglo (Profiel tonen) 12 januari 2013 13:36:21
Perhaps you might say it is a total nightmare in the shops at Christmas.
The general point, concerning metaphor and comparisons in Esperanto, is that they have to be internationally recognizable.
Doubt about this sometimes leads to a certain over-literalness in the language, when in fact a lot of languages use the same metaphor or comparison, so a direct translation could be used.
A case in point is the recent discussion over dormigi for 'to put to sleep' (an animal). It turns out that this figure of speech is known in many languages (including Chinese). But some Forum members wanted to argue for a more literal translation like eutananizii.
You are pretty safe however with expressions like 'as white as snow' (neĝe blanka), since the colour of snow is much the same the world over. Pillar box red, however would be problematic as leter-kestoj vary in colour from country to country.
Rugxdoma (Profiel tonen) 12 januari 2013 14:04:34
acdibble:I agree. There are so many aspects of a circus which can be compared, and many of them vary over time and space. In Swedish a similar expression ("rena rama cirkusen" ) is used to indicate that something is disorganised or chaotic, in spite of the fact that a modern Nordic circus is neither.
For the second sentence, I wouldn't say it in Esperanto. I think it may be too idiomatic in English to be carried over. Unless the store literally became a circus, I wouldn't say it.
J_Marc (Profiel tonen) 13 januari 2013 23:51:48