jkph00:While I'm asking, is there a colorful Esperanto equivalent for the expression "not the happiest seed on the strawberry

I've never heard the strawberry one. Does it, in fact, mean "not the happiest member of a group"?

Incidentally - we all have our burdens, inhabitants of different places. Perhaps rural people feel that city politicians ignore them while making decisions affecting them. That's a valid idea, though in most places, rural people are over-represented in elected bodies; a representative of a rural district might represent, for example, 100 people, whereas a person representing a city district may represent 500 or 1000 people. In that sense, rural people's votes punch above their weight.

But even if this were not the case, a vote always beats no vote. If you live in Washington DC, like me, you aren't represented at all. We pay federal taxes but we have no vote in Congress - that's why our licence plates say "Taxation without representation", because that's our situation.

jkph00:"If his lips are moving, he's lying." How would I best express that one?

From the proverbaro, Li mensogas maŝine seems like a pretty good, if not exact fit!

erinja:

jkph00:While I'm asking, is there a colorful Esperanto equivalent for the expression "not the happiest seed on the strawberry

I've never heard the strawberry one. Does it, in fact, mean "not the happiest member of a group"?

It could indeed, Erinja, but it's most often used around here simply to imply a somewhat unhappy individual. My North Carolina relatives use it especially often that way. The group part doesn't seem to matter much. It might be said of someone, for example, who's feeling as welcome as a skunk at a lawn party.

erinja:But even if this were not the case, a vote always beats no vote. If you live in Washington DC, like me, you aren't represented at all. We pay federal taxes but we have no vote in Congress - that's why our licence plates say "Taxation without representation", because that's our situation.

It does seem unfair, doesn't it? The general opinion around here is if you have to pay, you should get to play. Do you get to vote for the president? Or is DC just generally disenfranchised?

J_Marc:

jkph00:"If his lips are moving, he's lying." How would I best express that one?

From the proverbaro, Li mensogas maŝine seems like a pretty good, if not exact fit!

That does indeed fit. I like the image, too, and that's what I look for. Thank you!

jkph00:

erinja:But even if this were not the case, a vote always beats no vote. If you live in Washington DC, like me, you aren't represented at all. We pay federal taxes but we have no vote in Congress - that's why our licence plates say "Taxation without representation", because that's our situation.

It does seem unfair, doesn't it? The general opinion around here is if you have to pay, you should get to play. Do you get to vote for the president? Or is DC just generally disenfranchised?

We do vote for the president, but only since the 23rd amendment, in 1961. It's a relatively new thing, in the grand scheme of things.

We aren't even allowed to fully govern ourselves. We have a local government (since the 70's - prior to that, Congress ruled us directly), but Congress can overturn our laws if they feel like it - and they do so on a semi-regular basis. It seems like they use it to make a point on hot-button issues with the people back home, wherever they came from. It's highly irritating because normally if someone votes to overturn a law you were in favor of, you can vote against them in the next election. But surprise! Since DC residents don't get a vote in Congress, no member of Congress has to worry about what anyone in the District thinks about what they do to us. So you just have to grit your teeth and take it.

That's why the taxation without representation quote is on our license plates, to raise awareness. We have a greater population than Vermont or Wyoming, but most Americans aren't aware that we don't have a vote.

erinja:

jkph00:

erinja:But even if this were not the case, a vote always beats no vote. If you live in Washington DC, like me, you aren't represented at all. We pay federal taxes but we have no vote in Congress - that's why our licence plates say "Taxation without representation", because that's our situation.

It does seem unfair, doesn't it? The general opinion around here is if you have to pay, you should get to play. Do you get to vote for the president? Or is DC just generally disenfranchised?

We do vote for the president, but only since the 23rd amendment, in 1961. It's a relatively new thing, in the grand scheme of things.

We aren't even allowed to fully govern ourselves. We have a local government (since the 70's - prior to that, Congress ruled us directly), but Congress can overturn our laws if they feel like it - and they do so on a semi-regular basis. It seems like they use it to make a point on hot-button issues with the people back home, wherever they came from. It's highly irritating because normally if someone votes to overturn a law you were in favor of, you can vote against them in the next election. But surprise! Since DC residents don't get a vote in Congress, no member of Congress has to worry about what anyone in the District thinks about what they do to us. So you just have to grit your teeth and take it.

That's why the taxation without representation quote is on our license plates, to raise awareness. We have a greater population than Vermont or Wyoming, but most Americans aren't aware that we don't have a vote.

I honestly thought that DC was a part of Virginia D: I know they had some things different from the state, but I thought that was because it was the Capitol.

That being said and getting back to idioms, the only time I've heard the mushroom one is always WITH the explanation "kept in the dark and fed shit".

Maverynthia:I honestly thought that DC was a part of Virginia D: I know they had some things different from the state, but I thought that was because it was the Capitol.

That being said and getting back to idioms, the only time I've heard the mushroom one is always WITH the explanation "kept in the dark and fed shit".

Maryland and Virginia both donated land for the creation of the District of Columbia. The District was intentionally set apart from the states, because the founding fathers wanted to make sure each state was fairly represented, and it was felt that any state that could claim the capital city would have an unfair advantage. For better or worse, this is why DC is not part of any state, and also why its representation (or lack thereof) is the way it is.

As for the idioms: I don't think I've ever heard a phrase like "not the happiest seed on the strawberry" before...at least, not referring to happiness. I have, however, heard phrases like "not the brightest bulb in the box" or "not the sharpest pencil in the box", referring to intelligence. I've also heard both of those, with "crayon" instead of bulb or pencil.

I've also noticed a number or creative phrases, all with the same basic structure, suggesting someone might be a bit crazy; my dad's favorite was "a few bricks short of a load", but it almost seems to be a game to shift the nouns to fit more closely to whatever the current topic may be.

I wonder if those sorts of word games translate to Esperanto, or if it would be a bit much to expect people with other native languages to interpret things the same way as a native English speaker.

It almost doesn't matter what expression follows 'ne la plej X-a ..' because the intended meaning is given away by the meaning of X-a.

More problematic are those type of colourful expressions where there is no give-away qualifier. For example he is a few sandwiches short of a picnic.

sudanglo:It almost doesn't matter what expression follows 'ne la plej X-a ..' because the intended meaning is given away by the meaning of X-a.

More problematic are those type of colourful expressions where there is no give-away qualifier. For example he is a few sandwiches short of a picnic.

Yes, I take your point that with such a phrase it would be unclear whether the expression were a metaphor or not since one truly could be a few sandwiches short of a picnic. I certainly do like the expression, though.

Perhaps the phrase "ne la plej feliĉa semo en la frago" would work as an Esperanto metaphor simply because a person would immediately realize happiness cannot apply to a strawberry and thus must apply to someone or -thing else?

I wouldn't use it as an Esperanto metaphor; people might not be totally sure what it refers to. I don't really think of strawberries as being especially happy, and though they have seeds, I don't know that people even particularly think of them as being seeded fruits.

Maybe "Ne la plej feliĉa floro en la bukedo" (not the happiest flower in the bouquet) works. I think of flowers as being an unreservedly "happy" thing. You can also imagine a wilted flower drooping, mimicing an unhappy person.