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Esperanto conversational connectors

av tomboyden, 28 augusti 2013

Meddelanden: 16

Språk: English

tomboyden (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 02:06:27

Hey all,

I've been practicing Esperanto for nearly 2 weeks and it's grand!

To improve my speaking, I've put together a list of conversational connectors for speaking in Esperanto:

http://languagecycle.wordpress.com/2013/08/28/espe...

Tomorrow, I'll have a video out with some of these phrases being used 'in context'.

Check out http://anthonylauder.com for a brief description of conversational connectors and his youtube channel, FluentCzech.

A good command of conversational connectors allow one to move a conversation with flow, add to any topic you're speaking about, and sound a bit more 'advanced' than you may actually be. They're also super fun, enjoy and share!

Timtim (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 07:21:41

tomboyden:A good command of conversational connectors allow one to move a conversation with flow, add to any topic you're speaking about, and sound a bit more 'advanced' than you may actually be. They're also super fun, enjoy and share!
I totally agree, Tom. Use of these connectors also marks the difference between a good, theoretical speaker and a truly fluent conversationalist.

However, your list is riddled with literal translations which make no sense whatsoever. I'm thinking of things such as:

- by the way – - – per la maniero (= by means of the manner)

- and one more thing – - – kaj oni pli afero (where "oni" = one as in "one says, one does, one thinks and "pli" hasn't been declined to match "afero")

- can you tell me please – - - vi povas diri al mi bonvolu (a question without "ĉu"? "bonvolu" when there's already a conjugated verb in the clause?)

- would you be interested in us talking about something else? – - - ĉu vi estus interesata en ni parolas pri io alia? (Ugh. At least the first two and last three words are correct. But this could never be a valid Esperanto sentence.)

Those are just four things picked at random. Yes, Esperanto is relatively easy but that doesn't mean that it's a form of coded English and you just replace an English word with an Esperanto equivalent.

I wouldn't want you to be disheartened and this could be a valuable resource to help people make that transition from theoretically sound to fluent in delivery, but you really need to learn the language yourself before coming up with these. Two weeks' learning is too little.

Dive a bit deeper into Esperanto and then look again at that list maybe a month from now. With a bit more experience I bet you too will be able to spot what's wrong. That's the good news, at least - you'll be able to see for yourself that you've made progress in the space of a few weeks.

Good luck!

sudanglo (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 09:00:13

As Tim says, quite a few of your translations will need revision. Why don't you post them here (not all at once) and let Forum members help you.

Duko (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 09:29:19

Hello Tom, the list is a very good idea, please don't give up on it. Probably most of the entries will need corrections, a task with which certainly many forumers will help.
In general, you should pay attention to avoid calques, i.e. to translate the meaning and not the words. And secondly, to follow the EO grammar.
Here are some entries from the first part of the list where I have some suggestions, they might be wrong, but I'm sure others will spot and correct any mistakes.

anyway - iel
my suggestion: "iel ajn"
"ajn" for "any", "iel" means "somehow", "someway"

well, as a matter of fact – - - bone, kiel fakte
my suggestion: "nu, fakte"

how can I put it? – - - kiel mi povas meti gxin?
my suggestion: "kiel mi povas esprimi gxin?"
"put" doesn't have the same meaning for non-English speakers

now and then it seems to me that - nun kaj tiam sxajnas al mi ke
my suggestion: fojfoje sxajnas al mi ke

after all – - – post cxiu
my suggestion: post cxio, malgraux cxio
"cxiu" means everyone

all joking aside - - - Cxiuj sxercas apartigas
my suggestions: sensxerce, tute sensxerce
the end result should be an adverb, something ending in "-e" is desirable.

Timtim (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 10:21:16

Duko:anyway - iel
my suggestion: "iel ajn"
"ajn" for "any", "iel" means "somehow", "someway"
No, this isn't accurate. It's not "any way" as in "do it any way you like". The normal way Esperanto-speakers express something like English anyway is ĉiuokaze, although (the once-erroneous) ĉiukaze is now accepted and probably more common.

erinja (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 11:43:01

Duko:how can I put it? – - - kiel mi povas meti gxin?
my suggestion: "kiel mi povas esprimi gxin?"
"put" doesn't have the same meaning for non-English speakers

after all – - – post cxiu
my suggestion: post cxio, malgraux cxio
"cxiu" means everyone
The point of the connectors is to sound fluent and to use common expressions that fluent people use. I don't know many people who say "post ĉio" for a meaning like "after all". I don't know that this expression would be used at all in esperanto, nothing springs to mind.

For "How can I put it?" in normal conversation, no one I know would say "Kiel mi povas esprimi ĝin?". I would personally say "Kiel diri?"

pdenisowski (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 19:19:17

You could also check ESPDIC to see if these phrases are in the dictionary. For example:

anyway : iel (ajn), iamaniere

as a matter of fact : fakte, effektive

how can I put it? : kiel esprimi? kiel diri? (not in ESPDIC)

now and then it seems to me that : de tempo al tempo ŝajnas al mi, ke

after all : finfine

all joking aside : senŝerce

Of course, there are often many ways to say certain things and usage varies between speakers as well, so always best to check multiple sources.

Amike,
Paul

pdenisowski (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 19:19:17

There are also some great resources like Being Colloquial in Esperanto as well as many textbooks, etc. One of the things that I do as part of compiling ESPDIC is writing down interesting expressions / figures of speach as I come across them.

Amike,

Paul

pdenisowski (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 19:24:11

erinja:I would personally say "Kiel diri?"
That's how I say it. There's even a phrase dictionary of Esperanto entitled "Kiel Diri" - highly recommended.

Amike,

Paul

RiotNrrd (Visa profilen) 28 augusti 2013 20:58:27

Enthusiasm like this is great to see, but as you might have gathered from the subsequent posts, it may need to be redirected into learning the language first before you start trying to teach it.

There aren't just a few errors; the whole list needs serious overhauling. However, it definitely can serve as the seed for what could be a very useful page eventually. Right now, however, it is just a very misleading page, as it presents many incorrect phrases - some entirely nonsensical - as being correct in an authoritative manner. I would unpublish it for the time being, until it can be fully revised.

Give yourself time to learn the language. Esperanto is easy, for sure, but don't make the mistake of thinking it is easier than it actually is. There are many things that you have yet to learn. There are still things that *I* have yet to learn, and I've been at it eight years now.

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