Beiträge: 45
Sprache: English
marco_ (Profil anzeigen) 3. September 2013 12:02:24
Kion vi pensas pri tiu teksto kaj debato pri Esperanto tie?
English has been my pain for 15 years
Demian (Profil anzeigen) 3. September 2013 13:32:35
marco_:What do you think about this text and comments about Esperanto there?La verkisto de la teksto ĝuste montras sentojn de multaj angla-lernantoj ekster gepatre angla parolantaj nacioj (Anglosfero). Mi parolas angle. Mi povas legi romanojn anglalingvajn. Mi rare parolas al personoj, kies gepatra lingvo estas angla. Maloftaj okazoj, kiam interparolo al gepatraj parolantoj okazas, sentiĝas mi ke mi neniam povas paroli kiel ili. Malkuraĝiĝita, mi trovas komforton en vortoj de Chinua ACHEBE kiu diris ke afrikaj (ankaŭ antaŭe malliberigitaj laŭ mi) verkistoj neniam verkos kiel geangloj. Anstataŭ, Achebe aldonis, afrikaj verkistoj devas strebi ŝanĝi anglan tiel ke ĝi eblas esprimi afrikajn kondiĉojn sen perdi parencon al ĝia hejmlando. Citaĵon oni povas trovi en eseo "The African Writer and the English Language." (La Afrika Verkisto kaj la Angla Lingvo). Oni povas Google-serĉi la eseon.
Kion vi pensas pri tiu teksto kaj debato pri Esperanto tie?
English has been my pain for 15 years
Mi parolas tiujn ĉi vortojn ne kiel komencanto de la angla. Mi jam laboris por angla kanada gazeto.
The writer perfectly captures the feelings of many English speakers outside the countries where English is a first language. I can speak in English. I can read English novels. I rarely speak to people whose mother tongue in English. On those rare occasions, when that happens, I have the feeling that I can never learn to speak like them. Disillusioned, I find solace in Chinua ACHEBE who once said the African (by extension ex-colonial) writer could never write like an Englishman. Instead, Achebe added, African writers should try to mould English in such a way that it was able reflect African realities without losing touch with its homeland. The exact quote is in "The African Writer and the English Language." You can Google it.
I am speaking these words not as someone who is beginning to learn English. I have worked for a Canadian English newspaper.
kaŝperanto (Profil anzeigen) 11. September 2013 22:31:06
As for the communication between dialects, it must be easier on native speakers. I can perfectly understand British, Australian, and other native speakers (unless they use copious amounts of slang).
I would say English has been my pain for 24 years...
Bemused (Profil anzeigen) 11. September 2013 23:20:57
There are many different versions of Manglish (Mangled English).
Even so called "native speakers of English" manage to mangle the language in both spelling and vocabulary.
My pet peeve at the moment is the use of "of" instead of "have".
The phrase "should have" is verbally shortened to "should 've".
People then mistakenly extend this to "should of", and presto, the language is mangled by so called "native English speakers".
The problem is not with the users but with the language itself.
English speakers spend more time in school attempting to learn the spelling of their language than any other language, and still English has the highest rate of functional illiteracy. (Not counting the speakers of other languages who are illiterate because of lack of access to schooling).
Mustelvulpo (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 13:01:31
kaŝperanto (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 13:17:47
Mustelvulpo:Last spring, when I was watching the National Spelling Bee, it occurred to me that probably not many other languages would have such a contest or have the need for one. There were so many words I never heard of. (ageusia, belomancy, cynosure, fimbrillate, jicama, mussitation, nubuck, tectogene, yannigan, zwinger). Even as a native speaker, English has been my pain for over half a century. I think it's a shame that it's becoming the international language. It's not a good choice to fill that role.I didn't even think have spelling bees.
(sorry Bemused, couldn't resist)It does make very little sense to have one of the most difficult languages, spoken by relatively few people (as compared to other languages), as the international language. As much as I hate the idea of learning how to read Chinese characters, Mandarin would be a much better choice. I wonder if we will have a future like that of Joss Whedon's "Firefly", where English and Chinese are both known by everyone.
korona (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 13:54:01
Perfect language? Not in any respect. Neither is my mother. But only the lowest kind of human would not love his or her mother on the grounds that she wasn't perfect. I love her in spite of her imperfections, and somtimes dare I say because of them. So too with my mother language.
Yes, English can be a pain. But no pain, no gain. I would not consent to the ease of an IAL if I could not also keep the rigorous exercise that my native tongue provides. Ease is important, but without a workout I'd waste away--true of the body, true of the spirit.
As an international language, however, English seems to me only too useful as a tool of Imperialism. If anyone wants to learn English as a second language, I welcome you--but you shouldn't be forced to.
P.S.: I love spelling competitions. And if they only exist in English, so much the better--I can be proud of a sport that exists only in my language!
Fenris_kcf (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 15:16:08
kaŝperanto:… Our elected officials are wondering why our students are falling behind those of other nations, yet they fail to see English as the possible (likely) cause. I can't even imagine trying to learn English as a non-native speaker. …
kaŝperanto:… one of the most difficult languages …I agree that English is much more difficult in general than many people claim it is. But aren't you exaggerating a little bit here? The basic grammar of English is relatively easy. Only the orthography is really messed up from the bottom to the top. Reforming it ain't possible i guess, though i would like to see it.
Lørniq Iqlic wiþ ə ri:formd ortågrəfi: wud bi: kwayt intristiq ay ges.
But again: The grammer ain't hard to learn and since you don't need to care for orthography in oral communication, English mostly does a good job as a "bridge-language".
michaleo (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 15:50:26
Fenris_kcf:I agree that English is much more difficult in general than many people claim it is. But aren't you exaggerating a little bit here? The basic grammar of English is relatively easy. Only the orthography is really messed up from the bottom to the top. Reforming it ain't possible i guess, though i would like to see it.Yes, you don't have to care about orthography but you have to care about pronunciation. Considering that English has many sounds which don't exist in many languages (44 phonemes), there is need to memory a phonetic transcriptipon of each word. Because Latin letters don't indicate you how you should pronounce them. And don't forget that then you would only know how to pronounce them but you wouldn't be able to write them.
Lørniq Iqlic wiþ ə ri:formd ortågrəfi: wud bi: kwayt intristiq ay ges.
But again: The grammer ain't hard to learn and since you don't need to care for orthography in oral communication, English mostly does a good job as a "bridge-language".
marco_ (Profil anzeigen) 12. September 2013 16:04:25
Fenris_kcf:The basic grammar of English is relatively easy. Only the orthography is really messed up from the bottom to the top.I agree with you, English has easy grammar. The phonetics of English is complicated. Portuguese, my native language, is the opposite.
Fenris_kcf:But again: The grammer ain't hard to learn and since you don't need to care for orthography in oral communication, English mostly does a good job as a "bridge-language".Many people learn and practice English through reading. Therefore, they memorize pronunciations that not exist. So, to understand what people say becomes difficult. For me, English is easy to read and impossible to listen.