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quick translation

by ShannonCC, November 16, 2013

Messages: 7

Language: English

ShannonCC (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 7:39:11 PM

Kia vi estas?

Kia estas vi?

Are either of those right? The first was used in a Muzzy video.

RiotNrrd (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 7:58:29 PM

ShannonCC:Are either of those right?
Well, if you mean to say "What kind are you?" (or "What sort are you?" ), then either are right.

If you mean to say something else, then not so much.

ShannonCC (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 9:08:01 PM

Yes, I think that's what it's translating to.

It says Kia vi estas and the answers are "Mi estas forta" or "Mi estas bela", etc.

But why Kia vi estas instead of Kia estas vi? Are both ok or is one better than the other?

Bruso (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 9:15:04 PM

ShannonCC:
But why Kia vi estas instead of Kia estas vi? Are both ok or is one better than the other?
There's no point in inverting the subject and verb as in English (or German, or many others) in Esperanto. There's always a question-word like "kia" or else "ĉu".

RiotNrrd (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 9:31:20 PM

La kato manĝas la raton.
Manĝas la raton la kato.
La raton manĝas la kato.
La kato la raton manĝas.
(There's even a few more possibilities)

All of the above sentences mean exactly the same thing. The cat eats the rat.

Because we mark the subject and the direct object (and the verb, for what that's worth) we can place the words in any order and it doesn't matter - we will still always know who (the noun without the -n) is doing what (the verb) to whom (the noun with the -n).

The most common order of words in Esperanto sentences is more or less the same as in English (which is strongly SVO; Subject-Verb-Object). But, if we want, in Esperanto we can shuffle the order around much more so than we can in English (OVS, VSO, SOV, etc.).

Generally, within a clause, the order of words doesn't matter. There are a few exceptions - "la" always precedes its noun (although you can cram a few adjectives in-between), "ne" always precedes what it negates, etc. But as long as it's clear which is the subject and which is the direct object, the order you put the words in is generally up to you.

This is another reason for adjectival agreement for plurals and the accusative case. Such agreement means we can tell which adjectives go with the subject and which go with the direct object; we cannot rely on the order of the words to tell us.

ShannonCC (User's profile) November 16, 2013, 9:36:26 PM

Ok, thanks. I remember reading something about that recently but still, most things I've read/heard (at this early stage of learning Esperanto) are along the lines of English ordering.

Thanks for all those examples RiotNrrd. Wow, sort of weird, lol! It's confusing but I guess something I'll get used to in time.

sudanglo (User's profile) November 17, 2013, 11:41:11 AM

Because the usual order in main clauses in Esperanto is SVO, other orders tend to have the nuance of emphasizing one of the elements. (Though sometimes the pattern is varied to just to accommodate a lengthy element and thereby make the sentence more intelligible)

However the neutral or normal order with K words follows a different logic, eg Kion vi manĝas (OSV) is a normal order.

In the case of Kia ŝi estas, this would be a neutral order.

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