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Lojban

od Aubright, 11 grudnia 2013

Wpisy: 35

Język: English

acdibble (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 02:54:00

Aubright:I see, I see. Would you say it's more complex than a natural language?
Much more so.

trojo (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 16:11:16

Aubright:I see, I see. Would you say it's more complex than a natural language?
It is more complex than a natural language by design-- the desire to stamp out ambiguity is taken to quite an extreme. For example, there's like 20 different words for "and" because that word/concept is too ambiguous in most natural languages.

lagtendisto (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 19:23:25

I see ambiguity like some possibility to be creative. How I got it Lojban is intented to create interface language usable by humans which machine algorithm can imitate without any efforts. Its light switch on - light switch off down-scaled machine language. As long fuzzy non-schematic languages rule the world we human being are save. okulumo.gif

Bruso (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 20:27:48

trojo:
Aubright:I see, I see. Would you say it's more complex than a natural language?
It is more complex than a natural language by design-- the desire to stamp out ambiguity is taken to quite an extreme. For example, there's like 20 different words for "and" because that word/concept is too ambiguous in most natural languages.
The classic joke about Lojbanists:

How many Lojbanists does it take to change a broken light bulb?

Two. One to decide what to change it into and one to find a bulb that emits broken light.

robbkvasnak (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 21:07:00

Then I wonder who teaches French Lojban....

makis (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 21:23:26

Bruso:The classic joke about Lojbanists:

How many Lojbanists does it take to change a broken light bulb?

Two. One to decide what to change it into and one to find a bulb that emits broken light.
Ha ha, awesome.

robbkvasnak (Pokaż profil) 13 grudnia 2013, 22:15:42

That's nothing. I used to teach Portuguese Spanish and Spanish Portuguese until I had to teach English English (or didn't they understand me?)

captainzhang (Pokaż profil) 15 grudnia 2013, 00:49:47

Before I started studying Esperanto I had looked into Lojban as an alternative, but found the combined facts that virtually no one speaks it and it has almost no literature, pushing me in the direction of Esperanto.

The little I learned about it from my initial exposure is this:
1. It is based on predicate logic. (second order logic)
2. It has features apart from logic that allows you to express things as unambiguously as possible.
3. It is the most perfect language ever to exist for perfectly translating things from one language to another, because of it's features that allow you to capture the exact meaning of every utterance, and the feeling of the speaker of the utterance at the time it was uttered. (I said utterance, although I didn't really mean the spoken language, it applies to that as well. I probably shouldn't have used the word "utterance" to begin with, but I'm not a linguist and not sure what the written equivalent is)
4. It's root vocabulary is based on the six most widely spoken languages of the time. (which is cool)

I believe that all scienctist and translators should learn Lojban so that they can express themselves (in written language only) perfectly, but I still think Esperanto is the best option for a world lingua franca, even though English basically serves that role to some degree right now.

Gleki (Pokaż profil) 26 stycznia 2014, 10:52:24

I do speak Lojban. I'd say it's not a competitor of Esperanto or English.

Lojban is different.
Lojban is baroque.

It's not that "Learn Lojban in 2 weeks" and start disseminating it. Primarily it's fun. And it helps me understand how other languages work.
Among us there are people who speak Esperanto, Spanish, French, Japanese.

The Lojbanic community that has been formed in the last years is pretty raumistic in spreading Lojban. Everyone understands that you won't be using Lojban at your job interviews. A pretty relaxing factor. Hobby and only hobby (hm, hobbies are for hobbits, well, then ... it's lojby.).

Gleki (Pokaż profil) 26 stycznia 2014, 10:52:24

I do speak Lojban. I'd say it's not a competitor of Esperanto or English.

Lojban is different.
Lojban is baroque.

It's not that "Learn Lojban in 2 weeks" and start disseminating it. Primarily it's fun. And it helps me understand how other languages work.
Among us there are people who speak Esperanto, Spanish, French, Japanese.

The Lojbanic community that has been formed in the last years is pretty raumistic in spreading Lojban. Everyone understands that you won't be using Lojban at your job interviews. A pretty relaxing factor. Hobby and only hobby (hm, hobbies are for hobbits, well, then ... it's lojby.).

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