bartlett22183:This brings up the point that those who are just beginning to learn a new language -- not only Esperanto! -- who have had no other experience beyond their native language seem to think that the new language is nothing more than their own language with other "strange" words substituted (the concept of relexification).

I remember when I first studied French as a young person long ago, there were other students who were baffled that "Je suis allant" was not perfectly good French for English "I am going." They had trouble wrapping their heads around the idea that "Je vais" covers "I go," "I am going," and "I do go" and that "Je suis allant" would seem literally bizarre to a native francophone. And so on with most other languages.

The same holds true with Esperanto for those komencantoj who have not yet internalized what we might loosely call the "spirit" of the tongue.

You've hit the nail right on the head (which, BTW, is a counter example of what we are talking about, since this idiom is almost literally equivalent to the Spanish "dar en el clavo", with the same meaning).

The problem, IMHO, is that people tend to think in their mothertongue while using another language. Though at first it may be slightly more difficult, I have found it very useful to think in the language I'm speaking or writing in. Now I'm thinking in English, not thinking in Spanish and translating on the fly into English. There's, however, a drawback. Sometimes I am writing in a language and quote something in another, and without noticing it, I go on writing in that second language, forgetting that I should write in the fist. But, anyway, this is something I can live with. (And not that I have a huge combination of possibilities anyway, I just speak Spanish, English and Esperanto.)

Regards.

Daniel

risgrynsgroet:

robbkvasnak:Missing are (words for) elbow grease, confabulation, talking points, amarillo and boombox (maybe these won't be around too much longer, I hope)- and landfill, clay pigeon, not, hobnob and eggnog. I still recommend it.

I'm a bit confused, unless this is a joke.

what is it that the words actually mean? Same as we can't say "a scrap of paper" or "someone who I'm cohabitating with and dating but not married and have no plans to marry as of now" in one concise word in English.

From the context of the whole post by robbkvasnak I believe it was meant as a joke.

"someone who I'm cohabitating with and dating but not married and have no plans to marry as of now" = partner (in colloquial speach of my dialect of English)

Bemused:From the context of the whole post by robbkvasnak I believe it was meant as a joke.

"someone who I'm cohabitating with and dating but not married and have no plans to marry as of now" = partner (in colloquial speach of my dialect of English)

Okay, good to know it was indeed a joke, my reading comprehension isn't so good sometimes haha.

(In my dialect, "partner" doesn't give any hints as to if you're married or not, or if you're living together or not, it just means you're in a (probably) long-standing relationship of some sort [and implies that it's a homosexual one]. "Significant other" likewise doesn't give many clues about the actual living/marriage situation, although that one more implies that you're living together you can't be sure.)

I can't recommend Wells' dictionary as it is no dictionary, but a simple word list, additionally a word list made inaccurately (cf. this article with further links).

The best esperanto to english dictionary is the 1967 "Esperanto-English Dictionary" by Montagu C. Butler. I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet. It isn't in print anymore (hopefully they issue a reprint someday), but I was lucky enough to find a copy on e-bay for a reasonable price, so they're still around. You just have to look a little bit. There is also a pdf floating around the internet somewhere.

I agree that Wells' dictionary is mostly a wordlist. It doesn't give any usage examples or give any clue as to what the nuanced senses of a word might be.

Going the other way, English to Esperanto, the dictionary by Peter Benson is the best as far as I know.

Gonzo:The best esperanto to english dictionary is the 1967 "Esperanto-English Dictionary" by Montagu C. Butler. I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet. It isn't in print anymore (hopefully they issue a reprint someday), but I was lucky enough to find a copy on e-bay for a reasonable price, so they're still around. You just have to look a little bit. There is also a pdf floating around the internet somewhere.

I agree that Wells' dictionary is mostly a wordlist. It doesn't give any usage examples or give any clue as to what the nuanced senses of a word might be.

Going the other way, English to Esperanto, the dictionary by Peter Benson is the best as far as I know.

I concur! I bought a copy in 1977 and used it so much it finally fell apart. Found another copy on a used book site and snatched it up. I keep on the lookout for other copies which I will buy and save for when #2 falls apart
It clearly marks which roots are listed as roots in the fundamento, those used in the fundamento but not in the "official vocabulary" and also all the added roots from the unua aldono to I believe the 8th aldono (of course additions since then are probably in there just not marked as "official" ). Also gives examples of word building with different affixes and, what I particularly liked, example sentences from Zamenhof's own works.

Gonzo:The best esperanto to english dictionary is the 1967 "Esperanto-English Dictionary" by Montagu C. Butler. I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet. It isn't in print anymore (hopefully they issue a reprint someday), but I was lucky enough to find a copy on e-bay for a reasonable price, so they're still around. You just have to look a little bit. There is also a pdf floating around the internet somewhere.

See Esperanto–English Dictionary by Montagu C. Butler (London 1967)!

Urho:See Esperanto–English Dictionary by Montagu C. Butler (London 1967)!

Brilliant! Really cool that someone has taken the time to update it and make it available!

orthohawk:

Gonzo:The best esperanto to english dictionary is the 1967 "Esperanto-English Dictionary" by Montagu C. Butler. I'm surprised no one has mentioned it yet. It isn't in print anymore (hopefully they issue a reprint someday), but I was lucky enough to find a copy on e-bay for a reasonable price, so they're still around. You just have to look a little bit. There is also a pdf floating around the internet somewhere. ...

I concur! I bought a copy in 1977 and used it so much it finally fell apart. Found another copy on a used book site and snatched it up. I keep on the lookout for other copies which I will buy and save for when #2 falls apart ...

I use the Alibris Book Service here extensively for used and some new books. I have had excellent results with them, although you have to set up an account. Right now they list a "good" used soft cover copy of Butler's dictionary for US$28.08 from a UK book dealer. (There would be a shipping cost to the US, but it might not be severe.) They also list a "very good" used copy from another UK dealer for US$59.43. As always with such book services, you have to buy while the copy is still there.

morfran:If ever you’re curious where this or that word came from while you’re making your way through the language, there’s a short etymological dictionary here.

But I can't understand it: it's in some language with Cyrillic letters; Russian I'm guessing? I only know a few words in Russian, so this doesn't help me much!