Hi all,

I recently saw this post in an Esperanto group on Facebook:

"Kion malsxatas al vi pri Usono ?"

(I understand that the sentence is not correct... this post is about the content, which I understood to mean "What don't you like about the US/What do you hate about the US?" )

It surprised me, along with many of the comments; it seemed to contradict my understanding of Esperanto as a language which aims to foster peace and understanding. Although of course criticism and reflection can lead to positive change, this seemed rather like an invitation to an open bashing session of one single country (which led to bashing of other countries), without any positive end goals in mind.

I'm not opposed to criticism and discussion, but this rubbed me the wrong way. It seemed to go against what I understand is the Esperantist movement.

Thoughts?

Cdub4language:
I'm not opposed to criticism and discussion, but this rubbed me the wrong way. It seemed to go against what I understand is the Esperantist movement.

Thoughts?

So you think we are not supposed to discuss in Esperanto about certain topics that go against (your understanding of) the Esperanto movement?

Actually we should discuss this not in the English forum, because this affects not only the English speaking Esperantists, doesn't it?

Cdub4language:Hi all,

I recently saw this post in an Esperanto group on Facebook:

"Kion malsxatas al vi pri Usono ?"

(I understand that the sentence is not correct... this post is about the content, which I understood to mean "What don't you like about the US/What do you hate about the US?" )

It surprised me, along with many of the comments; it seemed to contradict my understanding of Esperanto as a language which aims to foster peace and understanding. Although of course criticism and reflection can lead to positive change, this seemed rather like an invitation to an open bashing session of one single country (which led to bashing of other countries), without any positive end goals in mind.

I'm not opposed to criticism and discussion, but this rubbed me the wrong way. It seemed to go against what I understand is the Esperantist movement.

Thoughts?

Esperanto is just a language and people learn it for a wide range of reasons. Also, like any language its speakers can be nice, annoying, have strange views, dislike certain countries and like other countries etc etc.

Kion malsxatas al vi pri Usono ?

Oni diras:

Kion vi malŝatas pri Usono?
aŭ Kio malplaĉas al vi pri Usono?

You must not frequent the Viewpoints forum. The best way I can put it is that they are trashing the US government and not Americans in general, and especially not American Esperantists.

It is hard to deal with sometimes, but seen in that light I can understand it. Hell, I don't know a single fellow American who doesn't hate the government, so I can't get all angry when some foreigner does the same.

kaŝperanto:I don't know a single fellow American who doesn't hate the government...

ROFL; neither do I.

Christa627:

kaŝperanto:I don't know a single fellow American who doesn't hate the government...

ROFL; neither do I.

That's the beauty of living in a true democracy, you can openly post that you hate the government, safe in the knowledge that you and your family will still be alive tonmorrow.

Bemused:

Christa627:

kaŝperanto:I don't know a single fellow American who doesn't hate the government...

ROFL; neither do I.

That's the beauty of living in a true democracy, you can openly post that you hate the government, safe in the knowledge that you and your family will still be alive tonmorrow.

This is also the beauty of a true democracy. You can never know whether you and your family will still be alive tomorrow.

Bemused:

Christa627:

kaŝperanto:I don't know a single fellow American who doesn't hate the government...

ROFL; neither do I.

That's the beauty of living in a true democracy, you can openly post that you hate the government, safe in the knowledge that you and your family will still be alive tonmorrow.

I love China
Sometimes people ask me if I know what significant historical event happened in 1989 and I tell them, "Yes, I was born!"
If you don't know what I'm talking about Google it.
...'cause we don't have Google either :/

I will say, you were on Facebook, though it is not quite as bad as youtube comments, but when strangers get together on the internet without feeling a sense of community, people can say things without thinking about the whole person on the other end. Maybe an open-ended question would have been better and still would have allowed people to express themselves (which is the goal of any language).

If I think about the question in a non-controversial way, like "What do you dislike about chocolate?" then it supposes there is something wrong with chocolate. I love chocolate! but now it is no longer my place to say so.

Even so, they can still ask these questions, but one has to realize that it will get a certain type of response. Is it rude or unkind? Maybe, but as I understand the American point-of-view and ideals, there is a basis for an indispensable opposition. That's what I love about Americans. They are strong; they can take it.

I like what BlueMountain said with the idea that people are people no matter where you go, no matter what language you are speaking. (Granted, that's my response to what BM said. I hope that's alright. I don't mean to misrepresent your viewpoint, BM.)

Well, I think that while some people certainly have learnt Esperanto with the "peace and understanding" goal, others (like me) learnt it for other reasons.

Plus, even if it's written in a bad or angry way, actually being able to discuss things like "what don't you like" brings us closer to peace and understanding. If for example, there is someone from the USA who has zero clue about what their country has done and is doing to other countries and cultures, or even what it's doing to its own people (because, well, when you live inside the US it's harder to learn about all that is going on), they can find these discussions which have the true views and information from people from other countries, and not just people from -certain- other countries.

I can also say (having been born and raised in the USA but not living there anymore), that I feel a lot of anger towards how the US is, and feel that it has a lot of problems, but it clearly isn't a problem that only affects Americans but most of the world as it is now (for nice examples, due to ex. US military bases practically everywhere abroad, and US movies and companies). Sometimes this translates into anger for its citizens in general but I always know that it's simply due to bad education, or bad culture, and it's not like a "born trait".

But when you constantly overhear awful American tourists when you go to the city, or are swamped with bad tv shows and movies from there ("if the Americans didn't like this kind of show then we wouldn't be getting it on tv either" ), or when the entire reason why your country has any instant food to begin with is because "the USA likes it and the USA is cool", or when you meet an American who's shocked that "there's no Halloween in your country?!" and the American stores are actually trying to make your country start celebrating Halloween, you start getting irritated at the actual citizens despite yourself. It's just probably an especially big issue for a group of people like Esperantists who tend to feel a bit strongly about how cultures and languages shouldn't be washed away, and how people shouldn't be mistreated etc...