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Preposition and verb: One word vs. 2 words

viết bởi Aleksachjo, Ngày 22 tháng 9 năm 2015

Tin nhắn: 7

Nội dung: English

Aleksachjo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 04:13:27 Ngày 22 tháng 9 năm 2015

What is the advantage difference of having an infinitive and a preposition as a single word vs. two words.

Examples:

Kuniri vs. iri kun.

Mi iros kun miaj gepatroj.
Mi kuniris miajn gepatrojn.

Priparoli vs. Paroli pri.

Ni priparolis la vojagxplanojn.
Ni parolas pri la vojgaxplanoj.

Eniri vs. Iri en

En Usono, junuloj kiuj ankoraux ne 18 jaragxas ne povas eniri drinkejojn.
En Usuno, junuloj kiuj ankoraux ne 18 jaragxas ne povas iri en drinkejoj.

The only difference I've noted so far (and I'm a newbie) is that with one word you must use the accusative case.

johmue (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 06:53:10 Ngày 22 tháng 9 năm 2015

Aleksachjo:What is the advantage difference of having an infinitive and a preposition as a single word vs. two words.
It gives an awful lot of flexibility. Just some examples

Dum longa kunsido kaj longa priparolado la kunsidantoj atingis komunan prijuĝon. En la fina pritakso de la afero la estro diris ke foje necesas longe kunsidi kaj pripensi kaj gravas ke ĉiuj kunlaboru. La ĵurnalistoj ne rajtis kuniri en la kunsidan salonon, do ili atendis antaŭ la enirejo.

Miland (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 07:54:53 Ngày 22 tháng 9 năm 2015

Aleksachjo:What is the advantage .. of having an infinitive and a preposition as a single word ..
It makes for a more concise style, but its usefulness ultimately depends on making things as easy to understand as possible. This may be a matter of personal preference as well. For example I would prefer paroli pri la plano, though priparolado in other contexts would be fine. Again I would prefer eniri trinkejon to iri en trinkejon.

Evildela (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 02:02:06 Ngày 23 tháng 9 năm 2015

Miland:I would prefer eniri trinkejon to iri en trinkejo.
You probabaly know this and it's a mechanical mistake but just for clarity for others.

"eniri trinkejon" doesn't mean "iri en trinkejo"

"eniri trinkejon" = "to walk into a bar"
"iri en trinkejo" = "to walk (within) a bar"
"iri en trinkejon" = "to walk into a bar"

robbkvasnak (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 02:14:51 Ngày 23 tháng 9 năm 2015

Dr. Zamenhof was a very experienced person who understood that people whose L1 (first language) was different from another person with a different L1. So he did not create Esperanto to comply with just one way. He was clever enough to give us "-um-" and "je". He understood that the human mind uses language creatively and not mechanically. I know that this may bother some IT people today. And if Esperanto is your first L2, then it is easy to understand that you feel a little frustrated with these variations. English is much more dictatorial in its grammar.
I like to think of Esperanto as an enchanted island that I continue to discover while English is like an English garden, which may be pretty but not enchanting, not conducive to endless imagination.

Miland (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 07:36:54 Ngày 23 tháng 9 năm 2015

Evildela:"eniri trinkejon" = "to walk into a bar"
"iri en trinkejo" = "to walk (within) a bar"
"iri en trinkejon" = "to walk into a bar"
Dankon, I've corrected my earlier post.

sudanglo (Xem thông tin cá nhân) 09:45:17 Ngày 23 tháng 9 năm 2015

Sometimes the prep+verb combination has a meaning that wouldn't be reflected in verb followed by preposition, or verb followed by preposition would lead to an ungrammatical or clumsy form,

Mi antaŭvidas problemon.
Mi vidas antaŭ problemo !!!

Ĉu la monitoro estas enŝaltita?
Ĉu la monitoro estas ŝaltita en !!!

s-ro Etzel ellernis la lingvon en la daŭro de la vojaĝo mem
s-ro Etzel lernis el la lingvo en la daŭro de la vojaĝo mem !!!

Eliru per la ĉefa pordo
Iru el per la ĉefa pordo !!!

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