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truth about theory that language connect people .

ya ravana, 22 Septemba 2015

Ujumbe: 12

Lugha: English

ravana (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 11:27:14 asubuhi

In ex yu , croats ,serbs , bosniaks and montenegran speak the same language but that did not stopped the war in yugoslavia . Why would be different with esperanto ?

Matthieu (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 1:12:20 alasiri

I've never heard anyone claiming that Esperanto would "stop wars".

Tempodivalse (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 4:28:42 alasiri

Well, this was Zamenhof's original idea - that lack of a common language between peoples is a factor in tensions between them, and they are less likely to fight if they do have a common tongue. Most Esperanto promoters in the last few decades don't use this argument much, for good reason: there are too many counterexamples to the claim (civil wars).

Zamenhof was highly intelligent and politically smart - otherwise he could not have, almost single-handedly, cultivate an Esperantist community to a point where it could survive on its own (starting from the 1905 Boulogne convention).

But in other respects he was rather naive, as betrayed by his optimistic vision of the fina venko (the "all men will be brothers again" variety); and I think towards the end of his life he realised it. He must have felt terrible about World War I, which started a few years before his death in 1917. Perhaps it is fortunate that he did not live to the time of the League of Nations, where Esperanto was rejected.

sudanglo (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 4:53:16 alasiri

The relevant point here is perhaps, not that a common language prevents violent disagreements, but rather that if you are disposed to reach some accommodation with the other party, you will be seriously impeded in understanding their point of view without a common language.

A common language is a necessary but not sufficient pre-condition.

ustra (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 5:07:29 alasiri

Where does this childish believe come from that wars occur due to misunderstandings?
As a matter of fact all wars were and always will be carefully designed by the elites. It's all about business. Always.

Серёга (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 22 Septemba 2015 5:47:56 alasiri

ravana:In ex yu , croats ,serbs , bosniaks and montenegran speak the same language but that did not stopped the war in yugoslavia . Why would be different with esperanto ?
No language is the reason of this. It happens that the relatives kill one another but the differents live with peace.
You better see for that thay pay many to mass media, hirelings and traitors.

Alkanadi (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 28 Septemba 2015 8:15:51 asubuhi

In fact, if people speak the same language, they might hate each other even more. Imagine, we could understand what North Korea or ISIS was saying about us? Or, just go on youtube and watch memri Tv and then think about how this program might affect people's political bias?

However, if we don't speak the same language then it will be really hard for the world to be at peace. Communication is the first step.

Miland (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 28 Septemba 2015 8:36:42 asubuhi

ravana:In ex yu , croats ,serbs , bosniaks and montenegran speak the same language but that did not stopped the war in yugoslavia . Why would be different with esperanto ?
This is a very good point. Zamenhof didn't just believe in a common second language. He believed in homaranismo, a religious humanism that he felt could be a bridge between different communities. However the first world Congress in 1905 decided that the movement should be only a linguistic one, and so matters have stayed ever since.

sudanglo (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 28 Septemba 2015 10:35:20 asubuhi

What are the statistics? How frequent are wars between groups with a common mother tongue compared with wars between groups who do not share a language?

Isn't it much easier to see someone else as a filthy foreigner, if they speak foreign?

And since language, culture and identity are intertwined, how much easier it is for group speaking a different language to develop and become united round an idea which might be a cause of conflict with neighbouring groups.

Anybody for lebensraum?

If you don't have a word for something, it is difficult for everybody to get worked up over it.

Tempodivalse (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 28 Septemba 2015 12:49:40 alasiri

Isn't it much easier to see someone else as a filthy foreigner, if they speak foreign?
Sure, but again, plenty of counterexamples - look at the relationship between the two Koreas, or between Switzerland an the Third Reich. The common language didn't prevent demonising.

You get a much milder demonising in certain portions of the English-speaking world where certain accents are perceived as superior to others - you will probably be at a disadvantage if you speak English with an Indian or Arabic accent in the Deep South, especially if you don't look visibly white. I think language is only one of several factors involved.

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