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Esperanto in the news: Banishment?

fra Alkanadi,2016 5 25

Meldinger: 20

Språk: English

Zvoc47 (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 25 22:26:55

Woah woah woah "krokodili
en Esperanta medio paroli en lingvo alia ol Esperanto, kiu estas la gepatra lingvo de ĉiuj ĉeestantoj."
Is this a joke or serious? Does this say that Esperanto is the mothertongue of all presence? Does this mean that Esperanto is enforced if you're able to be excommunicated? Woah. I just remember all those EULA restrictions and terminations and SOPA, PIPA, ACTA, CISPA, etc.. Like, if you do this (where "this"=something that you would love and are supposed to freely do according to everyone's standards), you go to jail / get your license terminated / get excommunicated / get punished / get killed / etc. I wouldn't want Esperanto to be that.

Vestitor (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 25 22:33:15

Stop panicking. There's no Esperanto clergy who will be banishing anybody. There are people who attend UK events who don't speak Esperanto and they are not shipped off to an Island with a barrel of pickled herring.

Honestly if someone started all that nonsense if I happened to merely speak English to someone, I'd be putting them straight immediately.

erinja (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 25 23:02:05

Zvoc47:Woah woah woah "krokodili
en Esperanta medio paroli en lingvo alia ol Esperanto, kiu estas la gepatra lingvo de ĉiuj ĉeestantoj."
Is this a joke or serious? Does this say that Esperanto is the mothertongue of all presence? Does this mean that Esperanto is enforced if you're able to be excommunicated? Woah. I just remember all those EULA restrictions and terminations and SOPA, PIPA, ACTA, CISPA, etc.. Like, if you do this (where "this"=something that you would love and are supposed to freely do according to everyone's standards), you go to jail / get your license terminated / get excommunicated / get punished / get killed / etc. I wouldn't want Esperanto to be that.
No, you misunderstood it. "kiu estas la gepatra lingvo", that refers to "lingvo alia ol Esperanto"

It's basically saying, don't go speaking the national language at an Esperanto event in that country, because it isn't good form.

However, in practice, while it would be very frowned upon in many countries for two experienced speakers to have a long public conversation in their native language, people are very helpful to beginners. Being helpful to beginners includes talking to them in their own language (whatever that is) to help them out. I have stood at a booth at the Universala Kongreso and I managed to make at least minimal use of every language that I speak even a little of, to help out a beginner or give directions or whatever, and no one ever gave me a bad look.

It is normally obvious when someone is a beginner and people usually go out of their way to be helpful, including speaking languages other than Esperanto to answer a question or explain something.

Leke (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 26 05:54:11

Alkanadi:
Random fact: Crocodiles blow bubbles in the water to attract a mate. The bigger the bubbles, the more the female crocodile is attracted.
I'll remember that the next time I fart in the bathtub.

Larmel (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 26 07:24:43

Nobody banishes "crocodiles". If people are sometimes critical, it's because they feel the "crocodiles" aren't making any attempt to take part. If there are too many of them, they can affect everyone around them, so that everyone at the meeting ends up talking their own language instead of Esperanto.

When you're learning, and you make the effort to get to an Esperanto meeting, you want to find the people there are talking Esperanto, and not some other language you could talk very well at home! But of course, everything within reason. If people get growled at as soon as they say a few words in their own language, that's just going to put them off coming at all.

So, it all depends on the situation. I can understand that people who are not used to speaking Esperanto, and maybe don't speak it very easily, after spending an entire day talking in Esperanto at the World Congress, may well be relieved to relax in the evening with a group of people from their own country and relapse into their own language. If they are joined by someone who speaks a different language, it would be polite for at least some members of the group to converse with the newcomer in Esperanto. Otherwise, what are you doing at an Esperanto congress?

Nobody knows the origin of the word "krokodili". I wonder if it might have anything to do with the famous song "La krokodilo" translated by Lydia Zamenhof (daughter of L.L. Zamenhof). http://kantaro.ikso.net/la_krokodilo

sudanglo (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 26 09:04:07

It just occurred to me that whilst Esperanto has a verb (actually 3 verbs) to express the speaking of a national language when Esperanto is deemed more appropriate, it doesn't have a single verb to express the speaking of Esperanto when a national language would be more appropriate.

Ne Esperantumu, ni estas ambaŭ denaskaj anglalingvanoj.
Ne Esperantumu, mia amikino ne komprenus.

Alkanadi (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 26 09:31:06

sudanglo:...it doesn't have a single verb to express the speaking of Esperanto when a national language would be more appropriate.

Ne Esperantumu, ni estas ambaŭ denaskaj anglalingvanoj.
Ne Esperantumu, mia amikino ne komprenus.
How about this one.
Ne fin-venkegu, mia amikino ne komprenus.

00100100 (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 26 16:55:37

sudanglo:It just occurred to me that whilst Esperanto has a verb (actually 3 verbs) to express the speaking of a national language when Esperanto is deemed more appropriate, it doesn't have a single verb to express the speaking of Esperanto when a national language would be more appropriate.
Gaviali

Zvoc47 (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 28 11:48:44

Are these expressions insulting? Are they pejoratives? Or are they just polite sayings of what someone is doing?

Alkanadi (Å vise profilen) 2016 5 31 08:26:23

sudanglo:...it doesn't have a single verb to express the speaking of Esperanto when a national language would be more appropriate.
Ne malkrokodilu.

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