Mesaĝoj: 61
Lingvo: English
vejktoro (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-19 16:20:41
You'd also have problems like 'can't' being said differently per person. Some people say 'kæ:nt', others 'ka:nt' - how do you have a one sound one letter system like that?I think that the only way to standardize English fairly would be to create a number of regional standards. Of course, then all our books would have to be translated umteen times for all the standards.
Yuck.
I know that we here in Newfoundland would be hard pressed to come up with a standard for our little Island, as many differences exist here from community to community, and even within communities. Often these differences are great, encompassing pronunciation, grammar, lexicon... everything. You can tell if someone is from the east end of town by how they speak.
The tense system is different, we have some different pronouns, and even hints of grammatical gender. There is a sound produced by inhaling that many speakers (especially women) add to words of agreement (jokingly called the 'inhaletory affirmative', not sure what linguists call it.) I was surprised to hear that it doesn`t exist elsewhere.... what would the letter for that be?
It`s heaven for a linguist, but hell for an English teacher.
This is just one little corner of English. I can`t imagine some group trying to take on the whole planet. I`m sure there`d be a big fight and the entire project would fall in a pile.
It is good that we learn Standard Canadian English in school, but a shame that schools teach that the local versions are wrong. I think both can be supported. Besides, we hear all the standard we need on Television.
It makes me giggle to see the CBC using subtitles when interviewing Newfoundlanders, we get to see how they`d have said it!
Matthieu (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-19 17:12:15
vejktoro:There is a sound produced by inhaling that many speakers (especially women) add to words of agreement (jokingly called the 'inhaletory affirmative', not sure what linguists call it.) I was surprised to hear that it doesn`t exist elsewhere....I've heard it exists in Norwegian. (See Wikipedia).
vejktoro (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-19 18:01:13
Mutusen:Thanks for that. I knew we couldn`t be the only ones. I listened to the sound files and they are similar. Here the sound is less relaxed and has a raspy tone along with the breathy quality.vejktoro:There is a sound produced by inhaling that many speakers (especially women) add to words of agreement (jokingly called the 'inhaletory affirmative', not sure what linguists call it.) I was surprised to hear that it doesn`t exist elsewhere....I've heard it exists in Norwegian. (See Wikipedia).
Funny how it is associated more with female speech in Greenland and Newfoundland alike.
Also interesting that it is often associated with 'yes' in so many unrelated languages and cultures.
Senlando (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-19 21:34:28
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3m-y-qAbpL0
I'v never been to Newfoundland so I don't know how good of a representation this is.
Vejktoro, what do you think of this Car commercial?
(I know not all newfies talk like this, but do some?)
also is the term Newfie, deogatory to Newfoundlanders? I personaly don't think it should be and I'm not using it negativly, and didn't even think people didn't like the term until i read this,...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Newfie
your insight as a Newfoundlander would be much apreciated!
.....
I'v only lived in Canada, for 3 years now, so you'll have to forgive my ignorance
vejktoro (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-19 22:37:39
That was great. The accent was fine... definitely done by a livyer, or someone who knows one.
I must watch it again and read the subtitles...
The only one I saw was "Lard T`underin`", which means "Wow," not "I`ll take it."
But what the hay.
"Newfie" is hugely offensive to many. British Columbia is far far away. It gets more offensive the more easterly you get, so stay safe and don`t use it. The wrong guy will clock you!
If you hear a Newfie use it, let it go.. they are allowed.
Senlando (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-20 07:18:56
actually I'm in alberta, but with the size of canada, thats close enough. thanks!
ceigered (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-20 08:23:41
vejktoro:I think that the only way to standardize English fairly would be to create a number of regional standards. Of course, then all our books would have to be translated umteen times for all the standards.Well, there are some things I think the majority of English speakers could agree with, such as replacing the plural 's' with a 'z' (Even in 'catz', this would still work because it stands to reason that the unvoiced 'T' (as opposed to a 'D') would devoice the 'Z' (as opposed to a 'S')) The other way around this is to make 's' a /z/ sound whenever it's between vowels like in German, but then a /s/ sound between vowels would too be affected, therefore 'z' is by far the easiest way around the problem. Things like 'a', 'u' and 't' would be harder to standardise because of the regional variations (e.g., 'a' can be /æ/ or /a:/, 'u' can be /u/, /a/, /a:/, /ju/, 't' can be /t/ or a glottal stop....). In this case the different regional authorities would have to push for their own unique standardisations.
Man, we could set up a category for this, let alone an entire forum, and still have lively discussion.
andogigi (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-20 17:50:28
ceigered: In this case the different regional authorities would have to push for their own unique standardisations.This is exactly my point. I think the reasons that there are no regional authorities for language reform in English is because we English speakers are a stubborn lot who would simply ignore them. I don't think this is due to regionalism.
When Andrew Carnegie decided to give away his vast fortune, he gave millions of dollars to spelling reform societies. The majority of these funds were spent in America and the UK. The last I heard, there was only one newspaper in the world that still followed them, and I think they gave it up as well. (The New York Times) I used to cringe everytime I gazed on the front page and saw the word "thru", so I guess I'm as guilty as the next man. At any rate, that money was largely wasted because English speakers on both sides of the pond decided that they didn't, really care. Has anything changed?
andogigi (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-20 19:19:06
Miland (Montri la profilon) 2008-decembro-20 19:20:34
andogigi:(The New York Times) I used to cringe everytime I gazed on the front page and saw the word "thru"..I remember seeing "thru" and "donuts" in comics (Marvel and DC respectively).
Perhaps Bill Gates will take up Carnegie's baton. Simplifying English spelling could save a lot of time learning to read and write.