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Alternative Germanic country names in Esperanto

fra ceigered,2008 12 27

Meldinger: 6

Språk: English

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 27 09:58:37

Sal!
I've noticed that some Germanic countries have fairly simple names either in their own language or in Latin.

For example, Australia is derived from 'South Land' from 'Terra Australis Incognito'. Netherlands (or Nederland/Niederlande in Dutch and German) means 'Lowland(s)'. And Deutschland (Germany) is ultimately derived from 'þeudiskoz' (a reconstructed proto-germanic root meaning 'national, popular') and 'land'.

So, using these roots, I've come up with alternative names that (to my understanding) follow the rules of the fundamento.
(reconstructed name, official name)

- La Popullando (The popularland) = Deutschland (Germany)*
- La Sublando(j) (The lowland(s) = Nederland (the Netherlands)
- La Grandsudlando/La Sudlando = Australia
- La Anglland (The Angle land) / La Anglasakslando (the Anglo-saxon land) = England (not too sure about this, the etymology of the tribal name 'Angle' is not very certain,

I don't know how Proto-germanic grammar works, but I'd assume this is how the above words would translate (very roughly).

The Theudisklend (Deutschland)- The Peoples land
The Nidarlend (Nederland)- The Lowerland
The Sunthamlend - The Southland
The Anglelend - The Angle land

Anyway, Popullando and etc terms aren't intended to be a 'reform' or 'replacement', but just experimentation with Esperanto's agglutinative' features to translate the original meanings of these country names. I'm not sure if this is as possible with other country names, but the reason I think this alternative naming system could be useful is that it allows people unfamiliar with the native languages of these countries to understand the meaning behind the names. I mean, how could you expect a Chinese person to read 'Nederlando' and appreciate the etymology without any preexisting education in a Germanic language...

So what are your opinions? Are these names correctly formed? Are there ways to do this with other place names?

Anyway have a good one,
Chrisso

Here are links that show the roots:
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/Dutch
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/land
http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/nether

*In regards to 'Deutschland', I'm not sure how 'Deutsch' should be translated - as Popula, Populara, sxtata, nacia... Any improvements?

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 27 10:14:27

EDIT: In addition I know Chinese could be 'Mezlando/Mezaregno/Mezaregxlando' (with 'a' being placed between 'z' and 'r' to aid pronunciation from a fricative to a trill in the same location), as Zhongguo = Middle Kingdom/Country.

Japan could also be translated accordingly (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Japan#Etymology) as 'Sunlevigxlando' (considering 'Rising sun' and 'Sunrise' aren't really too different) or Sunlevigxantalando (Sun rising land) but this is getting long. Additionally, it could be 'Lando de la Levigxanta Suno' but this is a direct translation of the English nickname. Interestingly I've noticed 'Japan' in Esperanto is like English an exonym.

Frankouche (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 27 12:00:50

In french and in some latin languages we call Germany "Allemagne" which come from a germanic people the alamans/alamannen which comes from germanic "all mann".
So Alemanio/Alemanujo could work.

I think a lot of peoples call themselves "people", "nation", "the men"...

The german name for France is "Frankreich" which means "kingdom/empire of the franks" which is anachronistic. Franks, a germanic people, and their kingdom have disappear, although frank language is still spoken in Lorraine, north of France. Calling France "Frankregxlando" will smile me.

A choice has to be made to call the name of country : the name with which they call themselves or the name the others countries call them. I think both can be used, even if the first solution could lead to homonymes.

Rogir (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 27 16:14:01

I strongly disagree for translating Deutschland into Popullando, because many tribe names can be translated as people. This way there would be hundreds of popullandoj!
However, Nederland is translated as Low Land(s) in many languages, e.g. French: Pays-Bas, so I'm okay with calling it Malaltlando or maybe Baslando.

erinja (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 27 16:31:31

Anyone interested in the "true names" of things may like the "Atlas of True Names" maps. They are maps of Europe or of the world, with cities, countries, and geographical features, named using English translations of the etymological roots of the names of those places.

More information here:
http://www.kalimedia.com/Atlas_of_True_Names.html

For example, Great Britain is "Great Land of the Tattooed"

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2008 12 28 07:00:53

I see what you mean rogir about translating 'deutsch', especially since in English we refer to the Netherlanders as 'Dutch'. Maybe 'Deuxcxlando'? I didn't think about 'Malalta' as a way of saying low, so cheers for that ridulo.gif

Thanks Frankouche for that information, I always wondered where 'Allemagne' came from.

And cheers for the link Erinja, I'll have a look into that. If I can get my hands on it I think I could (with help and editing of course) translate them in my spare time lango.gif (even if someone else has done so, it would be a good work out for my Esperanto).

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