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Translate (transliterate?) company names, product names?

ca, kivuye

Ubutumwa 27

ururimi: English

jchthys (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 16 Ruhuhuma 2009 18:06:26

The Wikipedia articles on Internet Explorer (and others) in foreign languages all use the English name directly—even the Chinese ones. As the natural languages use the English names, so should Esperanto: many might not understand "Fajrovulpo".

I guess "Internet Explorer" is a little different situation, but in writing I'd stick with the official standard forms. These could have the translation glossed in parentheses. In speech, a form adapted to Esperanto phonology would be good; for example, Vindozo (which is transliteration, not translation).

szbizsz (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 17 Ruhuhuma 2009 01:34:33

I think for a well know brand name, one may simply leave it un-translated or at least quote it in a bracket. However for a company name one may translate the whole except the special name in it. For product names, one should translate all of them. See for example the Esperanto page of www.prettygarlic.com at http://www.prettygarlic.com/languages/esperanto/Es... in which all related fruits and vegetables products names are translated accordingly, such as garlic into ajlo, apples into pomoj etc. However, there are some vegetable names not easy to translate by word, for example Bok Choy, Choy Sum etc. They mean Chinese cabbage but you may find superstores in North America simply use the original Chinese/Cantonese names. Tofu is another example, not so many people call it Bean Curd. So maybe when one translate them into Esperanto, should consider the same principle.

Ironchef (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 17 Ruhuhuma 2009 16:02:09

One thing you have to remember when translating/transliterating trademarks and company names into Esperanto (and any other language) is that they might not be registered in that form. While that might be okay for forum postings and chat room banter, if one of us was to publish something in Esperanto, we could open up a legal storm. In most cases, non latin-scripted companies register their own names and a latinized form of their trademarks if they are going to do international business: [LISTO]
Samsung Group 삼성 그룹
Gazprom Газпром[/list]I think the best method is to use the original name the company would use themselves and then give a pronunciation suggestion for the name if necessary: Jen la nova aŭto de Mitsubishi (/Micubiŝio/).

ceigered (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 18 Ruhuhuma 2009 03:22:27

Ironchef:One thing you have to remember when translating/transliterating trademarks and company names into Esperanto (and any other language) is that they might not be registered in that form. While that might be okay for forum postings and chat room banter, if one of us was to publish something in Esperanto, we could open up a legal storm. In most cases, non latin-scripted companies register their own names and a latinized form of their trademarks if they are going to do international business: [LISTO]
Samsung Group 삼성 그룹
Gazprom Газпром[/list]I think the best method is to use the original name the company would use themselves and then give a pronunciation suggestion for the name if necessary: Jen la nova aŭto de Mitsubishi (/Micubiŝio/).
Ah, great point about the legal implications. And it probably wouldn't matter if the original pronunciation was slaughtered anyway, it happens in English and no one seems to care (well, I haven't had any angry Koreans chase me down for saying 'Samsung' the way I do).

The only problem I have though is with Micubisxio - wouldn't it be better to scrap the 'o' to prevent the reader from misunderstanding that the 'shi' syllable in Japanese is not only stressed (ignoring the fact there isn't stress on the 'bi' either) but has an 'o' at the end? Of course, that's probably just pedantic me rido.gif

Ironchef (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 18 Ruhuhuma 2009 16:22:41

ceigered:The only problem I have though is with Micubiŝio - wouldn't it be better to scrap the 'o' to prevent the reader from misunderstanding that the 'shi' syllable in Japanese is not only stressed (ignoring the fact there isn't stress on the 'bi' either) but has an 'o' at the end? Of course, that's probably just pedantic me rido.gif
Actually, I wrote "Micubiŝi" first, then went back and esperantized the name. I often see (and use myself) esperantized forms like "MSN-o" or "NASA-on" in the chatroom and I wonder whether it's absolutely necessary to be grammatically consistent when dealing with "foreign" terms? One of the things I always read when learning languages is that they almost always make spelling/grammar concessions when handling "foreign/imported" words and terms.

"Mi uzas MSN por babili kun miaj amikoj" seems sufficient to me but perhaps I'm not as much a purist as some people are ridulo.gif

Rogir (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 18 Ruhuhuma 2009 22:24:27

I agree that in most cases the abbreviation is good enough and unlikely to lead to confusion. Of course you would pronounce it mosonon and nasan.

Ironchef (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 19 Ruhuhuma 2009 17:59:44

On a side-topic; are many of you familiar with the stories (some I'm sure are apocryphal) about company names and slogans translated into foreign languages leading to hilarity and embarrassment?

I think it was Pepsi (correct me if I am wrong) who tried to translate "Choice of a New Generation" into Chinese but what they got was "Brings your ancestors back from the dead".

And KFC, also in China, had "Finger-licking good" mistranslated as "Chicken so good, you'll bite your fingers off".

There is more probable story about General Motors trying to sell the Chevrolet Nova in Mexico, and failing because "No va" in Spanish meant "doesn't go"....

I've been trying to thing of examples of advertising slogans which would be good in Esperanto, fun to say, or catchy. Anyone got any good ones?

henma (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 19 Ruhuhuma 2009 18:17:50

Ironchef:There is more probable story about General Motors trying to sell the Chevrolet Nova in Mexico, and failing because "No va" in Spanish meant "doesn't go"....
I don't think this one to be true also, because nova doesn't really sounds like "no va". In the second one, the stress is on "VA" while in "nova" it's in NO (at least, pronounced by a Spanish speaker).

The word nova is obviously associated to the word nuevo/nueva (new) for Spanish speakers or at least to some kind of star. On top of that, it's more common to use "no anda", instead of "no va" to say that something is not working.

The story that is true is why the "Micubiŝi" Pajero is named "Montero" in the Spanish speaker countries (I will not explain what pajero means in Spanish, see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mitsubishi_Pajero)

It would be interesting, nevertheless, to see some esperanto examples of mistranslations and/or curious translations.

Amike,

Daniel.

andogigi (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 19 Ruhuhuma 2009 18:23:40

Ironchef:On a side-topic; are many of you familiar with the stories (some I'm sure are apocryphal) about company names and slogans translated into foreign languages leading to hilarity and embarrassment?
Two of my favorites:

In China, the characters originally used to transliterate "Coca-Cola" into Mandarin translated as "Bite the Wax Tadpole". Sounds appetizing, doesn't it? Unfortunately, it isn't true. It does make for a good story, however, and the legend continues to spread.

In the US, the American Dairy Council had a very successful ad campaign using the simple slogan "Got Milk?". It was so popular, that they wished to repeat that success in the American Latino market. Unfortunately, the translation of the slogan they used in Spanish meant, "Are you lactating?" Imagine the confusion that one created? I think it was eventually changed to "Familia, Amor y Leche" (family, love and milk) or some other such nonsense. Somehow, it just doesn't have the same 'je ne sais quoi'...

Rogir (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 19 Ruhuhuma 2009 18:28:45

My bank is called Rabobank. Sure that sounds funny in Esperanto.

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