Please Make Way
ya rikardoabbot, 19 Machi 2010
Ujumbe: 25
Lugha: English
tommjames (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 19 Machi 2010 10:42:25 asubuhi
ceigered:Are you sure?Quite sure. Of course you don't have to take my word for it, if you trust PMEG then that should be enough (I presume you do trust it
)ceigered:how about "Bonvole veturigu"?It's fine, but less popular than bonvolu -i. In terms of meaning the difference between them is minimal so personally I just go with the more popular -u -i form.
ceigered (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 19 Machi 2010 1:02:33 alasiri
tommjames:Ah, I see. Cheers for that clarification Tommjames - btw I wasn't doubting your opinion if it came off that way, the logic was a bit new to me so my initial reaction was of a bit startled (like when I started breaking down phrases un my French lecture today eg. "qu'est-ce que c'est?" (What is it that it is?), which simply means "what is it?" - logical..ish)ceigered:Are you sure?Quite sure. Of course you don't have to take my word for it, if you trust PMEG then that should be enough (I presume you do trust it
ceigered:how about "Bonvole veturigu"?It's fine, but less popular than bonvolu -i. In terms of meaning the difference between them is minimal so personally I just go with the more popular -u -i form.
erinja (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 19 Machi 2010 5:42:41 alasiri
I might do it as, "Cedu la vojon, bonvolu", so that the important information is first, and the "please" part is at the end, adding politeness, but also giving the driver plenty of time to react.
Grammatically I think the two -u's are ok in this case, because the verbs are not linked, they are totally separate thoughts, and separated by a comma into their own clauses.
A final thought, "Bonvolu cedi!" might be just as useful. I think the part about "la vojon" is understood through context. It would be akin to saying "Please yield!" in English.
horsto (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 12:30:14 asubuhi
erinja:I beg you pardon, but what kind of logic is that?
A final thought, "Bonvolu cedi!" might be just as useful. I think the part about "la vojon" is understood through context. It would be akin to saying "Please yield!" in English.
If I would be a taxi driver and some guest would say to me: "Bonvolu cedi!" Then this would mean for me that he threatens me.
I don't understand the meaning of Please Make Way, but translating this, whatever it means, as "Ni cedu la vojon" is ridiculous.
erinja (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 1:09:58 asubuhi
tommjames (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 10:13:36 asubuhi
horsto:I don't understand the meaning of Please Make WayTo make way means to get out of the way and let someone pass. So if I'm coming down a path and say "please make way!" I'm asking people to move and let me through. If Erinja was in a car and said "let's make way" it is suggesting that we ourselves get out the way and let someone else have the way through.
but translating this, whatever it means, as "Ni cedu la vojon" is ridiculous.That translation was offered for "let's make way", not "please make way". And I think it's a fine translation. You have the way, and you want to cede it to someone else so they can come through.
Part of the confusion here might arise due to "make way" having 2 meanings in English. The first meaning (the one we're discussing here) is getting out of the way to let someome through. The other meaning (which we're certainly not discussing) is to make progress along the path or road or whatever it is ("make your way down the road, then turn left").
horsto (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 1:19:45 alasiri
tommjames:Thanks for the explanation, tommjames. So I was completely wrong. In fact I didn't think so much about the english phrase, but about the Esperanto sentence "Ni cedu la vojon". I thought that you wanted to express something like "Ni forlasu la vojon."horsto:I don't understand the meaning of Please Make WayTo make way means to get out of the way and let someone pass.
tommjames:I wouldn't have understood that. You don't have the way (if it isn't your way), therefore you can't cede it. You can cede the right to go first.
And I think it's a fine translation. You have the way, and you want to cede it to someone else so they can come through.
For me it would be more logical to say "Ni cedu", or perhaps "(Ni) lasu lin preterpasi".
andogigi (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 2:36:32 alasiri
tommjames (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 4:42:42 alasiri
horsto:I wouldn't have understood that. You don't have the way (if it isn't your way), therefore you can't cede it.In order to cede something you don't have to actually own it, it can also mean to relinquish occupation of something. The esperanto verb 'cedi' works the same way. From Revo:
Reta Vortaro:2. (tr) Lasi al iu ion, kion oni okupis, posedis aŭ pretendis:In this case we 'okupas' the way (because we're standing in it, and blocking it), and we cede it to the person who wishes to pass. Seems fairly straightforward to me.
horsto (Wasifu wa mtumiaji) 20 Machi 2010 6:30:55 alasiri
tommjames:That's right, you can use the word like this, but I nevertheless would have problems to understand the meaning.horsto:I wouldn't have understood that. You don't have the way (if it isn't your way), therefore you can't cede it.In order to cede something you don't have to actually own it, it can also mean to relinquish occupation of something. The esperanto verb 'cedi' works the same way.
andogigi:If we are actually asking someone to give up the right of way, couldn't we say "cedu la vetur-liberecon"? Or am I overthinking this?In the german language you could say: Liberigu la vojon.
I think it also works in Esperanto, because libera has this meaning, too.