Esperanto idioms
ca, kivuye
Ubutumwa 8
ururimi: English
Roberto12 (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 09:07:12
Unu la alia(j) = one another, each other
Ĝis (la revido) = bye
En (bona) ordo = good, well
ceigered (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 10:49:36
Roberto12:It's not something that people talk openly about, but there are idioms in Esperanto. Let's list them here. I'll start with three I know.Great idea! While "ĝis la revido" sort of sits on the fence a bit between idiom and a contracted form of a longer sentence, this will no doubt be useful. That said, I'm pulling mental blanks at the moment...
Unu la alia(j) = one another, each other
Ĝis (la revido) = bye
En (bona) ordo = good, well
While not so much idiomatic, how about:
Bastonetoj = Chopsticks (stick-ettes) - maybe more ambiguous than idiomatic.
Krokodilo = Speak a national language at an EO convention.
Aligatori = Speak a language to an Esperantist that isn't Esperanto but isn't your own language (maybe speaking their native language, or attempting to at least
).(Maybe Aviadilo could be included as being ambiguous, as it literally means "aviation tool", but is always recognised as being an aeroplane. You could probably say "giroskopoj estas aviadiloj", which is technically correct, but it just looks hilarious
)Then there's stuff which appears idiomatic, but others (... maybe me
) prefer to think of as just plain wrong:Korekta = "correct", "right", a false friend in actual fact, as the actual word is "korekti", and that means "to make correct", that said, if you said "tio estas la korekta elekto", this theoretically makes sense, as it's like saying "this is the choice which makes things correct".
And then there's stuff which is just plain wrong, no arguments about it, mostly false friends:
Foresto = Absence. Forest is "arbaro"
Roberto12 (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 13:08:27
The Lernu vortaro defines "korekta" as meaning "having to do with correction(s)".
As for the old chestnut "foresto", I just swallow the pill there
erinja (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 16:28:29
Simple "bastonetoj" could be any kind of small sticks at all.
One common idiomatic usage is how you express uncertainty about numbers.
For example, in English you can say "I will arrive in one or two minutes", but more idiomatically you can say "I will arrive in a minute or two"
In Esperanto, you could say "Mi alvenos post unu aŭ du minutoj", but we also have an idiomatic usage, "Mi alvenos post unu-du minutoj".
This usage is pretty much only seen with very low numbers. You would expect to see 'unu-du' or 'du-tri' but not 'dek unu-dek du'.
And it applies not just to time, but to imprecise counting. "Venis kun mi du-tri amikoj". ("Two or three friends came with me")
ceigered (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 16:54:19
erinja:It should be "unu la alian" and "manĝbastonetoj"Ah, my apologies - I was reading from 'Conversational Esperanto' (Don Lord), page 60:
Simple "bastonetoj" could be any kind of small sticks at all.
Ĉiutaga Esperanto de Don Lord:(Didn't you remark that when we ate noodles at our chinese friends', everyone noisily sucked - the sole manner to put the noodles in the mouth with chopsticks?)
"Ĉu vi ne rimarkis, ke kiam ni mangis nudelojn ĉe niaj ĉinaj amikoj, ĉiu brue suĉaĉis - la sola maniero enbuŝigi la nudelojn per bastonetoj?"
I reread and found a note nearby stating that it is bastonetoj here due to the mass of context lying around
(I think it was talking about the lack of chinese take-out venues in China, which makes sense because they have stalls there instead, where as for people who eat the italian way such a venue wouldn't be sufficient to eat noodles alone and quietly thus why takeaway exists in italian-style noodle eating countries).This usage is pretty much only seen with very low numbers. You would expect to see 'unu-du' or 'du-tri' but not 'dek unu-dek du'.So basically numbers that can't be confused and "joined together"?
Also, is it "unu la alian" with an accusative on "alian" because it's like saying "one to the other" (and thus uses the accusative like it's used in "iru en domon")?
Miland (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 27 Ruheshi 2010 20:38:59
ceigered:..is it "unu la alian" with an accusative on "alian" because it's like saying "one to the other"Yes. You could also use unu al la alia.
darkweasel (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 28 Ruheshi 2010 16:29:56
Miland:Or any other preposition in case the meaning of the sentence requires this.ceigered:..is it "unu la alian" with an accusative on "alian" because it's like saying "one to the other"Yes. You could also use unu al la alia.
edit: @ceigered: I wouldn't see korekta as an idiom. There are some verbs whose adjectival form mean a quality and not "related to the action". Some of these adjectival forms that come to my mind, apart from korekta, are fuŝa, veka, komplika and fiksa.
ceigered (Kwerekana umwidondoro) 28 Ruheshi 2010 16:54:38
darkweasel:Ah, I see, so the meaning is purposely removed a bit from the action by the nature of the root? Or as in their meanings are as if they have "eca" on the end? E.g. korekteca = corrective (?)? Or would that be the same as "related to the action"? Sorry for my confused responseMiland:Or any other preposition in case the meaning of the sentence requires this.ceigered:..is it "unu la alian" with an accusative on "alian" because it's like saying "one to the other"Yes. You could also use unu al la alia.
edit: @ceigered: I wouldn't see korekta as an idiom. There are some verbs whose adjectival form mean a quality and not "related to the action". Some of these adjectival forms that come to my mind, apart from korekta, are fuŝa, veka, komplika and fiksa.