メッセージ: 28
言語: English
darkweasel (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月25日 17:15:39
sudanglo:Something like this actually occured to me: until I looked it up in ReVo, I thought that dependi was made of just one root + ending. Pendi is a relatively rare word, and that's why this can easily happen. Anyway, as long as it doesn't cause any errors, there's no real practical problem.
I do remember being surprised by a beginner who said on another forum that they hadn't realised that 'prezidanto' could be analized as prezid-ant-o. In other words it was for them like prezident-o or sekretari-o.
RiotNrrd (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月25日 17:34:41
tommjames:For the life of me I still cannot fathom why anybody thinks the "intus" forms are difficult.They're not difficult so much as rare. So when you do come across them, you generally have to think about them more carefully in order to understand what is meant. Now, while thinking about something isn't necessarily a bad thing, it does tend to interrupt the flow of conversation.
sudanglo (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月25日 20:14:46
But I certainly have had the experience of reading long sentences in which the author has employed such usage and having to re-read to get the meaning. Which I wouldn't have had to do if the author had used compound forms, either -intus or estus -inta.
Has anybody seen a convincing sentence with -unta or -unto or -unte?
tommjames (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月25日 21:24:11
sudanglo:Has anybody seen a convincing sentence with -unta or -unto or -unte?I found a few in the Tekstaro:
La majstro kaj Margarita
Je mia honorvorto de eksa kapelestro kaj ĉefkantisto, neniu gratulus tian troviĝunton.
Monato
..pro hazarda preterdormo de l’ trafa momento dumprocesa fare de defendunta advokato,
..afiŝoj minacantaj vaguntojn per monpunoj ĝis kvin mil pundoj;
Miland (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月25日 22:48:56
Evildela:So let me get this straight:Looks all right to me. In fact you could leave the ' but I ..' bit as understood, so that e.g. 'I should have waited a little longer' would be Mi devintus atendi iom pli longe.
Mi devintus means "I should have, but I didn't"
Mi povintus means "I could have, but I didn't"
Wilhelm (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月26日 3:19:44
angel32163:How does this differ from:Let me take a guess at this.
"Mi atendintus iom pli longe."
and what would the sentence above mean if it does differ?
"Mi atendintus iom pli longe." - I would have waited a little longer.
atendintus - estus antendinta - would have waited
Mi devintus atendi iom pli longe - I should have waited a little longer
Mi povintus atendi iom pli longe - I could have waited a little longer
Mi atendintus iom pli longe - I would have waited a little longer
Am I close?
William
RiotNrrd (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月26日 3:36:15
Wilhelm:Mi devintus atendi iom pli longe - I should have waited a little longerSpot on, I'd say.
Mi povintus atendi iom pli longe - I could have waited a little longer
Mi atendintus iom pli longe - I would have waited a little longer
Am I close?
sudanglo (プロフィールを表示) 2010年8月26日 10:17:08
When 'estus devinta' means a moral obligation then 'should have' may be the translation.
But 'estus devinta' can also mean 'would have had to'
This is not a grammatical issue, but arises from the type of obligation that 'devi' covers.
The thing to remember is that when you see -us linked with -dev the obligation (there are different types) is unrealised.
And if you want to flag it as in the past, then you need -int.
If you need to be more specific about the 'devo' , you can use other roots eg 'necesi'.
That can be ambiguity unresolved by context with 'devi'.
'Li estus devinta murdi ankaŭ la edzon', might mean 'he should have also murdered the husband' or 'he would have had to murder the husband as well'. It depends on from what point of view you are discussing the case.