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Esperanto not official language, wikipedia needs a change

kelle poolt EoMy, 23. september 2010

Postitused: 18

Keel: English

EoMy (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 11:28.53

Although no country has adopted the language officially, Esperanto was officially recognized by UNESCO in 1954.[6] Today, Esperanto is employed in world travel,[7] correspondence, cultural exchange, conventions, literature, language instruction,[8] television,[9] movies,[10] and radio broadcasting.[11]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esperanto

I hope my bad English did not interpret it wrongly.

The River Hutt Province is already stated that Esperanto is one of the official languages. Even she is micro nation, this is the fact whether the country is micro or macro.

Thus, the wikipedia text needs to be updated.

darkweasel (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 11:36.03

So if you think that the Wikipedia article needs a change, why don't you edit it yourself? Or if you think your English is too bad for this, why don't you leave a note on the talk page? The talk page, not this forum, exists to discuss the content of Wikipedia articles.

EoMy (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 11:47.49

darkweasel:So if you think that the Wikipedia article needs a change, why don't you edit it yourself? Or if you think your English is too bad for this, why don't you leave a note on the talk page? The talk page, not this forum, exists to discuss the content of Wikipedia articles.
ok, thanks

tommjames (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 11:48.08

I think it would be wrong to say Esperanto has been adopted by a country just because some micronation that doesn't even use the language in any ostensible way happens to have it on its list of official languages. A micronation isn't a country, it's an entity which exists only in the mind of its creators or supporters. In my view the wiki article is fine as it is.

ceigered (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 12:10.09

As I and probably someone else stated before, this is a "nation" until the Commonwealth of Australia decides it's important enough to shut down for whatever reason. Despite a mishap involving an alleged accidental approval of the River Hutt province, if there was a murder, bushfire, or important tax evasion case occurring there (e.g. an corporation using that land on the basis of it being called a tax haven by the "ruler"), the authorities can easily go in there and shut it down since all that's there are about 30 people. But quite frankly, regardless if the place does have support by some, probably 99% of the Australian population doesn't care about them. So basically, as long as that status quo continues, they're free from any action from the Australian government. If they start causing problems though that would warrant police action in normal Australia though, they can expect to find the police at their doors, and if they do indeed have an "army" as they've stated on a website of theirs, well, then they've dug a very deep hole legally for themselves.

Additionally, it's constitutionally impossible for River Hutt to exist legally since the whole of Australia has to agree by the ballot box to let secession occur, the reason why Western Australia isn't a separate country today. Lawmakers of yesteryear must have been shrewd old fellows.

Anyway long point made shorter, they don't count as a nation or as official. They do count as a community however, like that Esperanto town in Germany. Otherwise, Wikipedia editors likely for the above reasons will just revert any edits you make, and that can get messy (if you've ever read the page discussions, you'll probably know what I mean, time to time there can be things almost akin to flame wars about the most pointless issues rido.gif).

Hutt River Province - Australian Embassy for Arab Emirates

Evildela (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 12:34.32

Actually there has been a police incident between the Hutt river principality and WA police before. The WA police arrested the prince for selling alcohol without a permit within his 'territory' However the police where later found guilty in WA court and fined in return. Also Hutt river took the Australian post to court for interrupting the mail service to there postal service, they won that court case as well. Now legally they are a valid state, but as everyone knows it all comes down to who has the bigger better army. Apparently they don't pay taxes, no ways really verify this - but if that’s the case then they'd be the only Australian residents to not pay tax.

On another note, we need an Esperanto town in Australia. Even the Cornish language in the UK has local goverment support!

Also one last thing, If you really looked deeper into the history of WA you would find that it was first settled by the French, and technically it still belongs to the French. I know a while back Australia asked for France to withdraw its claim to these areas, and got no response in return.

ceigered (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 13:12.03

Evildela:Actually there has been a police incident between the Hutt river principality and WA police before. The WA police arrested the prince for selling alcohol without a permit within his 'territory'
Well, I was thinking something more major (not quite Agape cult style, but more than a slap on the wrist fine for illegal alcohol vending)... If he did pay the fine though, it wouldn't help validate his claims.
However the police where later found guilty in WA court and fined in return.
What were they guilty of? I've tried googling but can't find any details so I'll need you to fill me in here.
Also Hutt river took the Australian post to court for interrupting the mail service to there postal service, they won that court case as well.
I imagine they should have won as they would have been considered residents of Australia, and it would be wrong for the post to stop service there under that understanding.
Now legally they are a valid state, but as everyone knows it all comes down to who has the bigger better army. Apparently they don't pay taxes, no ways really verify this - but if that’s the case then they'd be the only Australian residents to not pay tax.
I can't agree with the legality; I have read that technically they could have defacto legality due to a certain law, but I believe this may be countered by other legal requirements either not met or somewhat dubious. For example, the ruler dude styled himself monarch, but wouldn't that be illegal due to the fact that he is not from the English royal family or related in any way except by being a subject, and thus be a form of fraud?

As far as ATO goes, they don't pay tax, and for ATO purposes are considered "Non-Australian citizens".
On another note, we need an Esperanto town in Australia. Even the Cornish language in the UK has local goverment support!
+100*100^100. On an aside, I'd like to see a growing Cornish language community here too, apparently SA has a lot of Cornish communities (well, more than I realised). Heck, linguistic diversity and minority languages need more support in Aus in general no? lango.gif
Also one last thing, If you really looked deeper into the history of WA you would find that it was first settled by the French, and technically it still belongs to the French. I know a while back Australia asked for France to withdraw its claim to these areas, and got no response in return.
As far as I know the French claimed one island and that's it. I believe that the mainland and the rest of WA was only claimed by the British, formally as well, and before the French could in order to prevent a French penal colony in the same region. The Dutch and French explored a lot of it though. Settlement seems to have only been officially done by the British. Since Federation occurred before the HRP was claimed, from what I understand the legal framework was in place to prevent any lot of people from seceding if the rest of the country didn't agree unless the country split off from the Monarchy. I believe that ultimately the buck stops with Queen Elizabeth II and I haven't heard her decree that HRP be its own state yet okulumo.gif.

There may be gaps in my knowledge there, but I believe the crux of the issue is that they need someone other than Sealand to recognise them as a state; once that happens, such a feeling needs to spread to other nations without being shot down by Australian diplomacy, and so forth. Considering the only business venture I've seen internationally involving the HRP was akin to a conjob, they have a long way to go.

The only reason I can see the govt not doing anything is because it's not worth it. They need a big problem to occur in their favour so they don't have a chance to stuff it up again and make the situation even more complicated in HRP's favour.

qwertz (Näita profiili) 23. september 2010 15:07.29

ceigered:
Anyway long point made shorter, they don't count as a nation or as official. They do count as a community however, like that Esperanto town in Germany.
Esperanto language at German Herzberg am Harz (eo) | Herzberg am Harz (en) | Herzberg am Harz (de) doesn't have that official status like i.e. Sorbian language.

Due to lots of happenend e-o meetings in that city the City Council of Herzberg am Harz authorized the application of the local ICH e-o folks adding an official "Namenszusatz"(city name addendum) to "Herzberg am Harz" = "Herzberg – la Esperanto-urbo". So, spreading E-o in Herzberg is officially welcome by the local City Council. That means i.e. E-o lessons at public schools etc. But probably someone will not find a lot of e-o repesentation inside everyday Herzberg city life. However, there seems to be that E-o city name addendum at the train station. Until now I haven't been here, I just receive the regualar email newsletters.

Btw. the next JES will happen at an sorbian town.

Genjix (Näita profiili) 24. september 2010 12:11.28

- A nation is not a country.
- River Hutt is unrecognised by other nations.

I declare this room I'm in to be the new country of dlkdsnksdnksnwiuhnhnbflkbnjhbsf, with the official language as Esperanto!

Maybe clarify: "although the unrecognised micronation of River Hutt province adopted Esperanto as a constitutional language, together with English and French.". Probably not noteworthy. Might diminish Esperanto's status (although let's not be concerned with that on Wikipedia; truth comes first.).

Genjix (Näita profiili) 24. september 2010 12:32.23

Not being a grammar nazi, but you evidently worked hard on that post. Foreigners appreciate corrections usually. I like exercising my writing.

qwertz:Due to lots of happenend Because of e-o meetings in that citythere, the Ccity Ccouncil of Herzberg am Harz authorized the application ofby the local ICH e-o folks to add adding an official "Namenszusatz" (city name addendum) to "Herzberg am Harz" = "Herzberg – la Esperanto-urbo". So, spreadingpromoting E-o in Herzberg is officially welcomed by the local City Ccouncil. That means i.e., e.g E-o lessons at public schools etc. But pProbably someone you will not find a lot ofmuch e-o repesentation inside everyday in everyday Herzberg city life. However, there is seems to be that E-o city name addendum at the train station. Until now I haven't been here,; I just receive the regualar email newsletters.

Btw., the next JES will happen at anbe/happen in a sorbian town.
And completed:

qwertz:Because of e-o meetings there, the city council authorized application by the local ICH e-o folks to add an official "Namenszusatz" (city name addendum) to "Herzberg am Harz" = "Herzberg – la Esperanto-urbo". So promoting E-o in Herzberg is officially welcomed by the local council, e.g. E-o lessons at public schools. Probably you will not find much e-o in everyday Herzberg city life. However, there is that E-o city name addendum at the train station. I haven't been here; I just receive the regular email newsletters.

Btw, the next JES will be in a sorbian town.

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