Can't you just apply multiple times? It seems to give that impression in the EO message on the survey.

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Ĉu vi ne nur povas subskribi (tiu vorto estis tre amuza al mia amiko, kiu diris "look it says subscribey!") multoblofoje? Ŝajnas al mi ke ĝi estas ebla, laŭ la E-a teksto ĉe la nombrilo.

qwertz:I don't remember who made that statement but just to explain my healthy distrust (de: "Gesundes Misstrauen") regarding statistics. "Solely trust that statistics you falsified/faked yourself" (de: Vertraue nur der Statistik die du selbst gefälscht hast.)

That's my *grrr* "self-centered" view of point. But we can discuss about. I'm not self-centered ingrained with my opinion. I'm cabable to learn means change my opinion.

RE "Self-centred", I forgot the original thread but would I be right that the word "self-centred" sounds as if the person is moving their "self" to the "centre" of an issue or debate to a non-English speaker? I was just thinking this morning that "self-centred" would make more sense had it been made "self-centric" . Nevermind that haha.

Back to the original topic, what's better: statistics that you can't trust, or no information at all that you can't trust either? It's like Google Translate - it often does a bad job, but one can always use whatever patchy knowledge they have of the languages being translated to fix up the holes in the machine translation. Similarly, you can use a survey to check for holes or inconsistencies in the information. It does not require total trust to be of use

@Robertopigro: Sorry, I did not see your message before hand, when I replied to KIAaze and Evildela's conversation.

@Evildela:
Bedaŭri.
Mi aldonis la traduko nun (kun malgrandaj ŝanĝoj).
Mi ankaŭ realdonis mia rimarkigon al qwertz, ke mi forigis antaŭ vi poŝtis.

Mi forigis ĝin ĉar ne estas vera en ĉi tiu formo.
Sed la ideo estis ke la subskriba do la peticio prenas neglektindan tempon kaj do ne malebligas fari aliajn aferojn.
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Sorry.
I added the translation now (with small changes).
I also re-added my remark to qwertz, that I had removed before you posted.

I removed it because it isn't true in this form.
But the idea was that signing the petition takes a negligible time and therefore does not prevent from doing other things.

ceigered:

qwertz:
That's my *grrr* "self-centered" view of point. But we can discuss about. I'm not self-centered ingrained with my opinion. I'm cabable to learn means change my opinion.

RE "Self-centred", I forgot the original thread but would I be right that the word "self-centred" sounds as if the person is moving their "self" to the "centre" of an issue or debate to a non-English speaker?

Yes, that's what some of this folks are doing. They roll some imaginary red carpet directly above someones feet and march - into my elbow which holds an sandwich (they are intelligent enough not to do so, they even don't touch someone because what majesty touches the plebs) because I'm not willing to jump away because of deputized majesty is crossing along.

Or they let other people around open the metro door because they are very occupied - right hand a 200 pages paperback book and left hand holding backpack belt (no physical disabilities). So he is waiting in front of the door looking at the door opener without any word just gazing at the door opener 20 cm of his nose and waiting, and waiting, and waiting, and waiting (metro will leave in few seconds), and waiting, and waiting, that some slave nearby opens the door. Btw. next time I will take next door and let majesty alone.

etc.

en:conceit/ de: Dünkel

robertopigro:
I can't imagine Esperanto as the foreign language of shepherds lost on distant mountains or of African children with flies on their nose...

Interesting comparison. I assume your kind of "Esperanto pride"?

qwertz:Interesting comparison. I assume your kind of "Esperanto pride"?

I really don't understand what you mean by "Esperanto Pride"

Evildela:

qwertz:Interesting comparison. I assume your kind of "Esperanto pride"?

I really don't understand what you mean by "Esperanto Pride"

I have no idea what robertopigro points to with his "Esperanto pride". Maybe it's a kind of pride in the name of XYZ making some rally in the public and waving some flag. I could list some "flag waving pride movements". But I will not lists them here due that probably that listing will be misunderstood in this way that I intented to compare that special "flag waving pride movements" with that Esperantist's counting of robertopigro at this current thread.

For me "African children with flies on their nose..." sounds some - hmm. I personaly would not joke about. Anyway. Decide yourself.

The original was:

robertopigro:I'm the founder of the petition "Esperanto-parolantoj en la mondo" and I'd like to answer to some people who criticized my project. First of all, sorry for my not perfect English.
I accept all kinds of comments, but I cannot understand some of them. This petition, this "nombrado" doesn't aim to count world cyclers by waiting for them on a village crossroad. That's why I am inviting every Esperantist to urge all of his contacts to join the petition. Cyclers are all around the world, but Esperantists and I are inviting them to come to the same meeting point, to the same square. It's a kind of virtual parade, of "Esperanto pride" . Internet permits to create an electronical square, where you easily arrive in seconds from all over the world. Is this proposal silly? Come on, most Esperantists use the Internet, maybe not daily, maybe with the help of acquaintances, maybe once a year, but most (or all) have access to it. I can't imagine Esperanto as the foreign language of shepherds lost on distant mountains or of African children with flies on their nose... We are almost all active on the Web: and we can easily inform the few who still aren't. Why not try such an experiment? You don't need a quarter to sign the petition, only one minute: this way, even people from countries without an official Esperanto association -like me, living in Cyprus- can say "present". It doesn't cost anything at all, one can choose to remain anonymous if he doesn't trust the initiative. If everyone informed all of his friends and acquaintances, we would collect thousands of signatures in few days. Scepticism doesn't help.

Btw. Some amusing view at the "E-o movement": Kiel Varbi por Esperanto

numero 853!!

qwertz:

robertopigro:
I can't imagine Esperanto as the foreign language of shepherds lost on distant mountains or of African children with flies on their nose...

Interesting comparison. I assume your kind of "Esperanto pride"?

I think a more literal interpretation of Roberto's comments are in order; there does not appear to be any bad-hearted subliminal messages or traits in the message representing a sense of misguided pride.

I think what he is trying to say is quite clearly, and I must agree, that Esperanto is learnt by people with access to such "useless" knowledge. Would an African child in a 3rd world setting, or poor shepherd, bother learning Esperanto? Hell no, there's no point in learning it for them. Such people are more practical than those of us in the "1st world" who have access to computers and the internet and can afford to waste time learning a language that does not necessarily give us any increase in our standing amongst others in the world.

So, to abridge that: EO-learners and speakers have access to materials to learn EO which are non-vital. People in 3rd world countries or living remote from the futuristic infrastructure we here on this forum enjoy do not have access to such non-vital learning materials. Therefore, counting the majority of EOists is quite easy since we do not need to seek out those who don't have the internet, since if they don't have any access to the net, they probably aren't in a country where EO exists.

Radio~!:..I am involved in teaching Esperanto to English-speaking Africans..

Impressive stuff!

This is actually part of the reason why the Libera Esperanto-libro was created; because many people have need of free offline language-learning materials.

I think many people dream of a way out of the place they live in, or even just a window to the outside world, through paper correspondence.

Esperanto survived for a long time without the internet. Many older Esperantists still are active in the language but aren't really online.