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samueldora (Prikaži profil) 25. februar 2011 20:19:41
Novjork’ Novjork’
Knabino el Ipanema
La Bambo
Apudmoskvaj vesperoj
![sal.gif](/images/smileys/sal.gif)
erinja (Prikaži profil) 25. februar 2011 23:32:30
johmue:I don't really like the idea of translating songs from other languages into Esperanto.On the other hand, through Esperanto, we can learn the folk songs of other countries. Not just folk songs, but any popular songs that we wouldn't otherwise know.
Esperanto is a good way to get a window into another culture, through translated songs.
johmue (Prikaži profil) 26. februar 2011 12:59:37
erinja:For this purpose I'd prefer a witten translation, while listening to the song in the original language.johmue:I don't really like the idea of translating songs from other languages into Esperanto.On the other hand, through Esperanto, we can learn the folk songs of other countries. Not just folk songs, but any popular songs that we wouldn't otherwise know.
Esperanto is a good way to get a window into another culture, through translated songs.
samueldora (Prikaži profil) 26. februar 2011 21:40:00
Especially for Esperanto IMO it is very important to have translations of well known songs. One of the first criticisms against Esperanto I heard was, that such a planned language may be suitable to exchange information, but would be poor in poetry. Every popular song with a good translation to Esperanto can refute this.
johmue (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 14:39:23
samueldora:I like to have the choice between a song in the original language and a translated version. It is like playing the song with an other instrument and has a different emotional value.Then people argue that Esperanto does not have a culture as there are obviously only translated songs.
Especially for Esperanto IMO it is very important to have translations of well known songs. One of the first criticisms against Esperanto I heard was, that such a planned language may be suitable to exchange information, but would be poor in poetry. Every popular song with a good translation to Esperanto can refute this.
Why can't a good song that's originally in Esperanto show, that Esperanto is suitable for poetry?
In my oppinion Esperanto is beyond the point where it has to proove that it can express everything and can be used for cultural things. Esperanto now has to proove that it is strong enough to come up with own culture.
In short: Esperanto has prooven that one can say everything in it, now it is to proove, that Esperantists have something to say.
erinja (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 16:35:44
johmue:Esperanto has many original songs, so when talking about "original Esperanto songs", I think that this isn't something that is in any way lacking in Esperantujo. I would hazard to say that in Esperanto music published today, there is much, much more original Esperanto music than translations of other songs.
Then people argue that Esperanto does not have a culture as there are obviously only translated songs.
Why can't a good song that's originally in Esperanto show, that Esperanto is suitable for poetry?
I don't see why there should have to be a choice between original songs and translated. Why can't we have both? Even non-Esperanto songs are frequently translated into other languages and localized.
qwertz (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 17:14:27
Contrary to that, in my opinion original E-o songs are quite useful for some kind of "E-o identity strengthening". With E-o identity I mean some kind of non-arrogant pride (unequally to Lingvo Internacia claim) of being part of an open-minded international scattered language minority community.
I would say that every musicans decides by oneselves what "message-channel" s/he would like convey to the regarding music style "audience". If they feel some motivation to convey a message of another musican via a translated/adapted "message-channel" that's fine. I.e. Vi kaj mi. If they feel E-o lyric expertised than they maybe will do with original E-o lyrics. That't fine, too. Speaking for myself I would grant both translated and original E-o songs to Esperanto heritage because both enable E-o community member having a nice time together at E-o festivals/renkontiĝoj.
Btw. Supporting non-esperantist's music groups to make E-o versions could also bring a lot of fresh input into Esperantujo. I.e. La registrado de la voĉaj partoj de la disko Revado.
johmue (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 20:22:47
erinja:Esperanto has many original songs, so when talking about "original Esperanto songs", I think that this isn't something that is in any way lacking in Esperantujo. I would hazard to say that in Esperanto music published today, there is much, much more original Esperanto music than translations of other songs."We" can have both, of course. Yet I do consider the original songs way more important than translated ones. We need orignal songs and we don't need translated ones. Maybe they are nice to have, like the ones by Stefĉjo.
I don't see why there should have to be a choice between original songs and translated. Why can't we have both? Even non-Esperanto songs are frequently translated into other languages and localized.
I am happy that Esperanto has far more original songs than translated ones. It would be a pity if it was the other way round.
Aiming to attract people to Esperanto isn't it much more impressive to say "Look, we even have our own songs." than "Look, we can even translate popular songs."? I just don't see the "gravity chute" of translated songs, where as I myself felt the one of original songs.
Maybe I am just thinking differently. When I studied Swedish, I was so curious about original rockmusic in Swedish. But I wasn't at all curious about how a song I already know from another language would sound in Swedish. Same with Esperanto. Same with languages I have not studied.
erinja (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 21:24:19
johmue:Aiming to attract people to Esperanto isn't it much more impressive to say "Look, we even have our own songs." than "Look, we can even translate popular songs."? I just don't see the "gravity chute" of translated songs, where as I myself felt the one of original songs.How much Esperanto promotional material have you seen? I have never seen an Esperanto promotional brochure advertising that Esperanto has many translations of popular songs. However, many of them do advertise that Esperanto has its own music groups etc.
The one translation-related task that does get advertised is that Esperanto has not only "native Esperanto" literature, but also translations of classics of world literature; therefore you are able to read the classics of languages you don't speak.
At any rate if you prefer not to listen to songs that have been translated into Esperanto, all you have to do is not buy those CDs. It's pretty easy to avoid if you don't like it.
johmue (Prikaži profil) 27. februar 2011 22:06:04
erinja:How much Esperanto promotional material have you seen?I just answered to the initial question in this thread:
[...]
Do covers exist for the Esperanto community? If not, why not? It could be a great way to attract people. I'm hoping there are some Esperanto covers.With this oppinion I disagree. That's all. What's the problem?