المشاركات: 20
لغة: English
Miland (عرض الملف الشخصي) 30 نوفمبر، 2011 4:59:54 م
gianich73:What does cribs mean? For me crib is a craddle.A "crib" can be a cradle, but the word also means a literal translation used by learners of a language.
erinja (عرض الملف الشخصي) 30 نوفمبر، 2011 5:08:45 م
sudanglo (عرض الملف الشخصي) 30 نوفمبر، 2011 8:57:02 م
Re-reading them now I come to the same conclusion.
This not to undermine in anyway Katalin's work for which I have the greatest respect.
And outsiders will not realize that you can't measure command of Esperanto in the same way as for a national language.
The general point remains valid, that the areas of difficulty present a different pattern to those in the national languages.
You only have to think about communication with native speakers in a shopping environment or work environment, or the expression of social attitudes to see the difference.
When did you last buy anything in a haberdashery from a native speaker of Esperanto, or listen to a mechanics report about problems with your car in Esperanto, or watch a police drama on TV in Esperanto.
Yet I'm sure that your Esperanto is fluent, and that by the standards we normally apply to 'spertuloj' you would receive top marks, as you have a near perfect command of the grammar, and a facility with word construction, and a reasonable general purpose vocabulary.
We can't really go much beyond that in assessing skill level in Esperanto until Esperanto is more widely adopted for daily use.
Yet the specifications of the Komunaj referenceniveloj are saturated with references to communication in real-life situations, where idiom and specific vocabulary are significant.
(And clearly in the case of Esperanto there are no comparable native speakers to measure the quality of the communication against)
The ordering of the categories A1 to C2 do not reflect the actual ascending scale of difficulty for the student of Esperanto. So that some skills from the higher levels may be easy whilst some skills from the lower levels may stump him.
Its all a bit like the Euro. Nice idea in principle, but full of tensions and practical difficulties in implementation.
erinja (عرض الملف الشخصي) 30 نوفمبر، 2011 10:01:53 م
sudanglo:When did you last buy anything in a haberdashery from a native speaker of Esperanto, or listen to a mechanics report about problems with your car in Esperanto, or watch a police drama on TV in Esperanto.My English must not be very fluent, because I'm sure I couldn't easily understand a mechanic's report of problems with my car, though I'm an engineer. I have done some sewing, but if you started throwing technical garment-related terms at me, as someone might do at a haberdashery, I wouldn't entirely understand it, even in English.
I think I wouldn't have a problem with an Esperanto-language police drama; the wording used doesn't tend to be overly technical, and since Esperantists don't make extensive use of impenetrable idioms, I would have an easier time of it than an English language learner trying to watch an English show (or even an American watching a British police drama)
I do think the CEFR levels are appropriate for Esperanto, with the exception of a very few points. It's true that someone wouldn't normally go to a doctor in Esperanto, but I have seen many instances where someone needed to describe their medical symptoms to someone in Esperanto.
4TheSol (عرض الملف الشخصي) 13 مايو، 2015 10:21:24 م
Multan dankon! Thanks for sharing this info as it seems to be just what I was looking for...and more!
grand_dan (عرض الملف الشخصي) 13 مايو، 2015 11:33:48 م
For example, the link for the "basa nivelo" test is: "http://www.itk.hu/data/files/minta_1/esperamto/esp...". In this link, the word esperanto is misspelled, using a "m" instead of a "n".
Another correction needs to be made in the "solvo" of the "meza nivelo" test.
"http://www.itk.hu/data/files/minta_'/esperamto/esp...". Replace the " ' " with a "1".
If you want to open the files, make sure to correct their hyperlinks.
I hope it helps!
Evildela (عرض الملف الشخصي) 14 مايو، 2015 12:09:41 ص
sudanglo:But Katalina, everybody knows that you only need 6 days to become a spertulo in Esperanto with the authority to demand substantial revision of the language.Made me think of a YouTube video I did a little while back on the accusative case:
The Accusative Case | La Akuzativo
Christa627 (عرض الملف الشخصي) 14 مايو، 2015 9:20:11 م
grand_dan:Just a technical remark, none of the PDF files mentioned in Erinja's post will open if their hyperlinks aren't changed.Wow, Dan, you're right! Apparently whoever made those links had a typo in the first one and then did copy-paste
For example, the link for the "basa nivelo" test is: "http://www.itk.hu/data/files/minta_1/esperamto/esp...". In this link, the word esperanto is mispelled, using a "m" instead of a "n".
Another correction needs to be made in the "solvo" of the "meza nivelo" test.
"http://www.itk.hu/data/files/minta_'/esperamto/esp...". Replace the " ' " with a "1".
If you want to open the files, make sure to correct their hyperlinks.
I hope it helps!
! Thanks for pointing this out; otherwise I'd probably assume the files weren't there anymore, without thinking to check the link.I enjoyed trying these out. I know it sounds a little weird to enjoy a test, but then I always have been a little odd that way
. I think, based on my results, that I'd probably do fine with the real thing, but it costs something to take that, doesn't it? 
Shamma (عرض الملف الشخصي) 15 فبراير، 2017 3:40:18 م
Gerry36987 (عرض الملف الشخصي) 3 مارس، 2017 2:50:47 ص
◆可以提供钢印、水印、烫金、激光防伪、凹凸版、最新版的毕业证、百分之百让您绝对满意；毕业证、成绩单，真实使馆、教育部认证，加急办理美国。
◆网上可查、永久存档、快速稳妥，回国发展，考公务员，落户，进国企，外企，创业，无忧愁◆
【办理各国高校文凭（世界名校一对一专业服务，可全程监控跟踪进度）】
【办理教育部学历学位认证，教育部存档，教育部留服网站永久可查】
【办理真实使馆公证（即留学回国人员证明，使馆存档可通过大使馆查询确认不成功不收费！！！）】
【办理留信网认证。（国家专业人才认证中心颁发入库证书，将在网内查询个人身份证信息后，同步读取人才网入库信息。） 】
◆毕业证、成绩单、真实使馆证明、真实教育部国外学历认证。让您回国发展信心十足！
QQ/微信:207758043 Email：207758043@qq.com
如果您是以下情况，我们都能竭诚为您解决实际问题：（英华教育)
1、在校期间，因各种原因未能顺利毕业，拿不到官方毕业证；
2、面对父母的压力，希望尽快拿到；
3、不清楚流程以及材料该如何准备；
4、回国时间很长，忘记办理美国；
5、回国马上就要找工作，办理给用人单位看；
6、企事业单位必须要求办理美国的；
QQ/微信:207758043办理真实学历认证.毕业证.成绩单.真实使馆认证★老品牌更专业★
◆一：回国证明的用途：
使馆教育处开具的《留学回国人员证明》是留学人员在国内证明留学身份、联系工作、创办理企业、落转户口、申请国内各类基金等必备的材料。留学人员持有此证明还可以享受购买进口汽车免税等多项优惠政策。
◆二：教育部认证的用途：
如果您计划在国内发展，那么办理各国国内教育部认证是必不可少的。一般企事业用人单位在您应聘时都会需要您提供这个认证。办理教育部认证所需资料众多且烦琐，所有材料您都必须提供原件，我们凭借丰富的经验，帮您快速整合材料，让您少走弯路。
！
联系人：Gerry QQ/微信:207758043 Email：207758043@qq.com