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Translation Help (is not?)

de cyanidearsenic, 24 de julio de 2011

Aportes: 17

Idioma: English

cyanidearsenic (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 03:54:34

I was trying to translate a slogan I've seen before into Esperanto but I can't figure out how to say 'is not'. Would it just be 'it is' with some sort of negation?

Also, if you'd like to help me with the rest I certainly won't complain...
The slogan is, "Equality is not a majority rules issue."

I couldn't find a word for issue in the way it's used there either. Does a word like that exist or do you think I should just substitute a similar word like problem?

Thanks for your time and patience!

etala (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 04:49:45

Would it just be 'it is' with some sort of negation?
Yes, the equivalent of "isn't" is "ne estas".
Also, if you'd like to help me with the rest I certainly won't complain...
The slogan is, "Equality is not a majority rules issue."
I would translate the slogan, but I'm not entirely sure what a "majority rights issue" is. Does the slogan mean that the majority group in society isn't concerned with equality? Or is it more like a ruling political party in a legislature doesn't care about something like disproportional representation in a legislature (for example, if the party doesn't have the popular vote but still has a majority)? Whose slogan is it?

This reminds me of when Claude Piron quoted a colleague:A translator is essentially a detective, who has to spend a lot of time trying to understand a topic before trying to render a text in another language.

EDIT: Ah, I misread "majority rules issue" as "majority rights issue, but I'm still not sure what the slogan means.

mnlg (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 06:05:16

cyanidearsenic:The slogan is, "Equality is not a majority rules issue."
I understand it as "Equality is not something to be solely defined by the rulings of the majority". If this is the correct reading, then I would propose something like

Egaleco ne ĉiam difiniĝu de la plimulto.

darkweasel (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 07:26:12

mnlg:
Egaleco ne ĉiam difiniĝu de la plimulto.
I have a slight problem with difiniĝu de. You've used de like in a passive sentence, but difiniĝu isn't passive - so I propose to use a real passive: egaleco ne estu ĉiam difinata de la plimulto.

mnlg (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 07:52:39

I do not think there is a problem in using "de" with such a meaning for -iĝ- verbs, at least from my own experience. It can be argued that those verbs, by expressing a becoming, confer a passive meaning, even if they are certainly not a passive form. (I would appreciate it if you could point me to the grammar rule(s) that refute what I am saying)

In its page about -iĝ- verbs, PMEG cites the example "Mi sciiĝis pri tio de homoj plej kredindaj", which I believe mirrors my translation.

At any rate, your translation is also fine. My main doubt is whether I caught the exact meaning of the slogan. ridulo.gif

3rdblade (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 08:19:11

I think 'issue' in this sentence is a bit of idiomatic clutter that English speakers understand, (especially US English speakers) but is not necessary in this translation. How about this:

"Egalecon oni ne povas elekti per plejmulta voĉdono."

("One cannot 'elect equality' by means of a majority vote.")

I think you could ditch the 'oni' and it would still be understood, too.

sudanglo (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 11:33:04

For 'issue', I think there are a number of possibilities in Esperanto, the choice depending on context. Demando, afero, temo spring to mind.

As a native speaker of English, I would certainly need more context to decide what "Equality is not a majority rules issue." means.

However ... La demando pri egaleco ne estas afero de la decido de la plimulto.

sudanglo (Mostrar perfil) 24 de julio de 2011 11:40:53

For 'is not' used as a tag at the end of a sentence to mean that you don't agree with what you have just said, you might try 'Mi pensas (ke) ne!'.

tommjames (Mostrar perfil) 25 de julio de 2011 07:39:13

mnlg:In its page about -iĝ- verbs, PMEG cites the example "Mi sciiĝis pri tio de homoj plej kredindaj", which I believe mirrors my translation.
It doesn't, "mi sciiĝis" there means "mi eksciis". The translation is "I found out about that from more believable people". Nothing passive going on there. "De" just shows the source from where you got the information in order to "find out".

Yes, I know that doesn't follow the usual logic of -iĝ in a transitive verb, but that's only because sciiĝi is an exception to it; the very reason PMEG puts it in a category called "dubaj iĝ-verboj".

mnlg (Mostrar perfil) 25 de julio de 2011 08:00:59

tommjames:"I found out about that from more believable people"
Fair enough; then read my "de" as "from", as well. ridulo.gif

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