Mensagens: 28
Idioma: English
kierenml (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 17:26:31
Really stupid question, but would the old saying "Keep Calm and Carry on" translate as
"Trankviliĝ kaj daŭrig" or is there an different way?
Dankon pro via helpo!
Kieren
mnlg (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 17:31:01
darkweasel (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 17:31:25
anyway: trankvilighi = to BECOME calm, so maybe "restu trankvila(j)" or just "trankvilu"
novmik (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 17:59:43
"Carry on": In England this phrase means to make a ruckus, dance about, banter, frolic, complain, etc...which are not calm activities.
Miland (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 18:52:28
mnlg:Trankvile antaŭen!+1
There's bound to be a number of ways of doing it, but I like this one!
novmik (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 20:12:12
Miland:The problem I have with "trankvile" is that its an adverb, and "Keep calm" has the air of a command. I think if to use trankvili, then you have to add 'u' thusly: "trankviliĝu, antaŭen." I like adding a comma instead of 'kaj', because the adverb "antaŭen" doesnt seem to follow kaj, and the directive is not "go calmly forward", its clearly a demand that someone first relax, then continue. "Daŭri" is not bad either for "carry on".mnlg:Trankvile antaŭen!+1
There's bound to be a number of ways of doing it, but I like this one!
mnlg (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 20:20:45
novmik:The problem I have with "trankvile" is that its an adverb, and "Keep calm" has the air of a command.Frankly I saw it as a suggestion. You are not wrong, but I still think the meaning can be expressed as "Carry on in tranquility", and that's a good enough render of my version.
But as Miland said, there is certainly more than a way to translate it, and my proposal was meant to be less literal.
tommjames (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 21:01:20
novmik:"Carry on": In England this phrase means to make a ruckus, dance about, banter, frolic, complain, etc...which are not calm activities.Yes it can sometimes have that idiomatic meaning, but it doesn't in the phrase we're translating so I'm not sure I see what your concern is there.
novmik:The problem I have with "trankvile" is that its an adverb, and "Keep calm" has the air of a command."Trankvile antaŭen!" to me feels like a volitive, as there's an implied "ni iru" (or whatever) attached to the adverb. I don't see the absence of volitive mode as a problem.
novmik:and the directive is not "go calmly forward", its clearly a demand that someone first relax, then continue.In translation it's not always necessary to preserve every shade and nuance from the original, and indeed it will often be impossible to do so anyway. Personally I quite like mnlg's rendering, I think it conveys the 2 essential ideas (calmness/continuation) well enough.
That said, I think a literal translation could be just as good here. I would go with "restu trankvila kaj daŭrigu".
novmik (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 21:55:44
tommjames:I like that one too, its more apt: "restu trankvila kaj daŭrigu", though I would probably have made the seeming error of making trankvila into an adverb, and making daŭrigu into daŭru like thus:novmik:"Carry on": In England this phrase means to make a ruckus, dance about, banter, frolic, complain, etc...which are not calm activities.Yes it can sometimes have that idiomatic meaning, but it doesn't in the phrase we're translating so I'm not sure I see what your concern is there.
novmik:The problem I have with "trankvile" is that its an adverb, and "Keep calm" has the air of a command."Trankvile antaŭen!" to me feels like a volitive, as there's an implied "ni iru" (or whatever) attached to the adverb. I don't see the absence of volitive mode as a problem.
novmik:and the directive is not "go calmly forward", its clearly a demand that someone first relax, then continue.In translation it's not always necessary to preserve every shade and nuance from the original, and indeed it will often be impossible to do so anyway. Personally I quite like mnlg's rendering, I think it conveys the 2 essential ideas (calmness/continuation) well enough.
That said, I think a literal translation could be just as good here. I would go with "restu trankvila kaj daŭrigu".
"restu trankvile kaj daŭru."
Because I imagine trankvila is describing how to rest, and thus is an adverb, and that daŭrigi is superfluous use of "igi", because it implies that something is being continued outside the person doing the action, like rather than continuing him or herself, he or she is continuing a game outside, like the difference between manĝi="to eat" and manĝigi="to feed something outside yourself" like a baby or pet that you feed.
I just wanted to mention that it is English slang from both the USA and England with different meanings: "to carry on", and also curious if there is an Esperanto expression that is slang for "carry on". Is there?
mnlg (Mostrar o perfil) 1 de agosto de 2011 22:18:10
novmik:daŭrigi is superfluous use of "igi""Daŭri" means "to last, to persist, to perdure", and it is intransitive. It is commonly used with events, like a storm or a football match. "Daŭrigi" is generally understood as "continue", as in "to make something last". I believe "daŭrigu" is the better choice, as the idea (or my perception of the idea) is that you are asking someone to keep on doing what they are doing, even if it is just consciously living their own life.