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The "wether or not" logical connector

de Ilmen, 30 noiembrie 2011

Contribuții/Mesaje: 25

Limbă: English

Ilmen (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 14:19:28

Bonan tagon al ĉiuj. ♪

I would like to ask you for the right manner to express the "wether or not" logical connector in Esperanto, that indicates that an assertion A does not depend on the truth-value of the sentence B, as in "A (holds true) wether B is true or not.

Let's take an example. How would you say "They will depart whether it would rain or not"?

My tries:
• Ili foriros ne se pluvos ("ne se X" would logically mean "wether or not X", right? But it is maybe somewhat awkward).
• Ili foriros se pluvos aŭ ne.
• Ili foriros memstare de se pluvos.

But I'm almost sure there is some other expressions for this.

Any comment would be greatly appreciated! ^^

sudanglo (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 14:58:13

Ĉu pluvos aŭ ne, ni iros.

TatuLe (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 15:35:50

- Ili foriros sendepende de ĉu pluvos aŭ ne.

Sendepende is a funny word rideto.gif
it rhymes with itself

Chainy (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 15:46:36

TatuLe:- Ili foriros sendepende de ĉu pluvos aŭ ne.
You could say that without the 'de'. "Egale ĉu" is an alternative to this.

TatuLe (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 16:10:51

Chainy:
TatuLe:- Ili foriros sendepende de ĉu pluvos aŭ ne.
You could say that without the 'de'. "Egale ĉu" is an alternative to this.
Is 'sendepende de ĉu' incorrect, or are 'sendepende ĉu' and 'sendepende de ĉu' both correct alternatives?

Another alternative could be 'Ili foriros sendepende de eventuala pluvo.'

darkweasel (Arată profil) 30 noiembrie 2011, 18:03:12

TatuLe:Is 'sendepende de ĉu' incorrect, or are 'sendepende ĉu' and 'sendepende de ĉu' both correct alternatives?
Both seem valid to me.

UUano (Arată profil) 5 decembrie 2011, 16:43:29

TatuLe:Sendepende is a funny word rideto.gif
it rhymes with itself
This literally made me laugh out loud. Thanks! sal.gif

Ilmen (Arată profil) 13 ianuarie 2012, 22:50:15

Sorry for my late reply, and thank you all of you for your ideas.

"Sendepende" is maybe a bit too long for being used just everywhere, but I take note of it. rideto.gif

Regarding the use of "ĉu ... aŭ ne", it lead me to wonder: can the word "ĉu" be used as a preposition?
So we can also use it without any adverb, as in the cases where a "wether or not" expression is used as a direct objet, for instance:

"He want to know wether you will come or not" = "Li volas scii ĉu vi venos aŭ ne".

Am I right on this point?

darkweasel (Arată profil) 13 ianuarie 2012, 23:17:28

Ilmen:
Regarding the use of "ĉu ... aŭ ne", it lead me to wonder: can the word "ĉu" be used as a preposition?
So we can also use it without any adverb, as in the cases where a "wether or not" expression is used as a direct objet, for instance:

"He want to know wether you will come or not" = "Li volas scii ĉu vi venos aŭ ne".
The sentence is fine, but ĉu is in this case not a preposition, but a conjunction.

BTW - your use of a non-standard color makes it more difficult to cite your messages, I’d appreciate it if you used the normal one.

Ilmen (Arată profil) 24 ianuarie 2012, 15:22:22

You're right, I made a mistake by writing "preposition". I meant "conjunction", of course. ^^''

As for quoting colored text, the only issue I can see is that in the case of partial quote, a remaining color tag (between brackets "[]") may appear therein. Then the better thing to do is simply deleting it, unless you absolutely want that the text stay colored.

And, of course, thank you for your help. ^^

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