Žinutės: 23
Kalba: English
drinkulo (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 08:15:17
Chainy:paramedic is as international as willow.sudanglo:It appears that paramedic is an international word. You could always create a new term under rule 15 - paramediko.I'm not too sure about that.
The other Wells suggestion is 'savhelpisto', which is rather like the German word 'Rettungsassistent'.
In spanish we say sanitario - sanisto, sanitaristo
Chainy (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 09:01:11
drinkulo:paramedic is as international as willow.Yes, indeed.
In spanish we say sanitario - sanisto, sanitaristo
This is rather like trying to find the right word to describe a military rank! i.e. very difficult.
But, 'ambulanckuracisto' or mabye 'ambulancisto' would surely be easily understood by everyone, wouldn't it?
A Google search brings up only one instance of 'ambulanckuracisto' actually being used, but anyway...
sudanglo (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 11:03:31
Where did you come across those words?Looks like para- has some independent life like tele-, Chainy.
So I created the word paramedicino. I didn't look it up in Wells, but nice to see he was thinking along the same lines.
Sanitara is a Zamenhofian word - meaning to do with public health. Not quite the same as what a paramedic does.
Sanatorio is a sanatorium.
A medic is not exactly a slang word in English, but it is a bit colloquial. It can cover a range of qualifications.
To capture that nuance I think medicinulo will serve. Or if you want to be really slangy, shorten that to mediculo.
Zamenhof use Doktoro in the sense of kuracisto, (medicina doktoro) so that provides another springboard for formation, as do 'sav' and 'asist'.
Ambulanco is in NPIV not only in the sense of the vehicle but also in the sense of a field hospital.
So ambulanculo/isto perhaps could be justified for the idea of the paramedic who gives initial treatment to road accident victims or wounded soldiers.
However at the end of the day, it is the case that a word like paramedicino is known to a number of languages.
erinja (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 14:35:47
Their use of existing Esperanto roots that are widely known helps their comprehensibility. Someone whose language doesn't use the para- prefix when talking about a paramedic could be totally lost when confronted with "paramediko" or "parakuracisto". But "ambulancisto" is easy to understand through context.
I'd put this in the same category as poŝtelefono (cell phone/mobile phone - literally, pocket telephone). It's something that uses existing Esperanto roots, easy to understand the first time you hear it, and doesn't imitate any other language's version of the word.
Aetaris (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 16:09:05
Chainy:It seemed to me that they were, I apologize for misunderstanding.Aetaris:And along with what Bemused said in my eyes there is a big difference between first aid and paramedic.
Was anyone suggesting that there wasn't?!
So ambulancisto would be more easily understood than sukuristo?
erinja (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 16:31:17
1) sukuristo would be a first aid person, which is different than a paramedic, in my opinion. Paramedic implies more training than someone simply trained in first aid.
2) I think the root sukur/ isn't easily recognized for those who don't speak Romance languages, and it isn't a concept that is discussed very often, so many people who don't speak Romance languages will not recognize it, and won't have had many chances to learn it. I think that "unua helpo" is much easier to understand than "sukuro" for someone who doesn't speak a romance language. I don't always care about such things but for something as important as medical care, I think that the recognizability of the words gains added importance. Many, many languages have some variant of "first help" as their term for first aid, and even if you speak a language that doesn't use this combination, the combination is quite easy to understand.
However, Wikipedia's page on the topic seems to use "sukuristo". The word sukur/ is used so repetitively on the page that it's a bit difficult to understand exactly what they're getting at.
Chainy (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 17:06:09
erinja:However, Wikipedia's page on the topic seems to use "sukuristo". The word sukur/ is used so repetitively on the page that it's a bit difficult to understand exactly what they're getting at.That Wikipedia page is about first aid, not about paramedics.
Chainy (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 17:12:48
Aetaris:So ambulancisto would be more easily understood than sukuristo?Both are easily understood, but they have different meanings.
'Sukuristo' means a first aider, and 'ambulancisto' and 'ambulanckuracisto' seem to be acceptable words for a paramedic.
erinja (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 17:20:32
Chainy:That Wikipedia page is about first aid, not about paramedics.Yes, that's absolutely true. And that's why I found this extract of the page to be confusing and/or misleading:
Wikipedia:Sukuri povas sukuristo, ricevinta ateston pri kompetenteco por sukurado, kiun li faras en sukurejo (urĝejo), tage-nokte preta por helpi al necesuloj, aŭ kiu alveturas al la vundito post telefona alvoko.It's talking about urgent care facilities, read to help people who need it, day or night, or to travel to the person who has been wounded following a telephone call.
Travelling to a wounded person to help them after having received a call sounds much more like a paramedic than a person offering first aid, in my opinion. It's not a very good Wikipedia article and it sounds to me like it's conflating first aid with urgent care centers and paramedics (these are three separate things in my opinion).
Chainy (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. sausis 24 d. 17:40:25
erinja:It's not a very good Wikipedia article...Yes, it's rubbish.
erinja:...and it sounds to me like it's conflating first aid with urgent care centers and paramedics (these are three separate things in my opinion).I don't think it's worth analysing that Wikipedia article. The significant factor in my understanding of 'sukuro' is that the words 'first aid' are shown in various languages at the bottom of the relevant ReVo page. Wells and Kondratjev back this up, too.
If you don't like using the verb sukuri, then Wells suggests an alternative: doni unuan helpon.