הודעות: 17
שפה: English
Frith Ra (הצגת פרופיל) 24 בפברואר 2012, 23:26:12
Ĉu oni scias tiel kiel la vorto pli bone estus tradukata? Se mi povas dauxri la vortludeco, tion estos eĉ plej ŝatema.
pdenisowski (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 00:54:49
Frith Ra:En manuskripto mi devas Esperantigi mi havas la frazon: "I've been manhandled by a woman and intellectually humbled by a computer in the same day." Mi havas problemojn kun la vorto "Manhandle."(In English, since this is the English section)
Ĉu oni scias tiel kiel la vorto pli bone estus tradukata? Se mi povas dauxri la vortludeco, tion estos eĉ plej ŝatema.
Of all my EN-EO dictionaries, only Wells has an entry for "manhandle" (krude puŝi), but I think either "mistrakti" or "fitrakti" might work as well.
If you're looking for a play on words, maybe "INsulti" (playing on the feminine -in-)? Not the best pun and it doesn't have the physical implications of "manhandle", but that's the only thing that springs to mind.
Hope that helps.
Amike,
Paul
sudanglo (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 11:45:16
According to NPIV Manipuli can refer to physical handling as well as more abstract manipulation.
darkweasel (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 12:02:16
sudanglo:farDe.
sudanglo (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 12:07:41
What is the meaning of la akcepto de la urbestro de la kongreso?
darkweasel (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 12:32:12
sudanglo:No, Dark Weasel. Think about it. Is it manhandling of a woman or by a woman -humilation by a computer or of a computer.If it’s really unclear, you can use fare de, but *far is an unofficial addition, and while some do use it, you definitely shouldn’t teach it to beginners.
What is the meaning of la akcepto de la urbestro de la kongreso?
sudanglo (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 18:04:26
It has definitely been around for over 30 years to my personal knowledge, and could be much older.
erinja (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 22:02:36
You're free to use it if you want but it isn't fair to suggest it to a beginner without some kind of disclaimer that some people consider this form to be wrong.
Singular use of ge- is an innovation that has been around for a long time, but I would never suggest it to a beginner without some kind of disclaimer that some people would consider it wrong. You want to give someone the information necessary to make their own decisions. Some beginners might not like to start using a form, and then find out later that it isn't normative. Some beginners might love the non-normative forms. But you have to give them the information to make their own decisions.
Frith Ra (הצגת פרופיל) 25 בפברואר 2012, 23:31:19
Mi dankas al Sudanglo por la sperta sugesto. Mi ne certas ĉe nun ĉu mi uzos «far » aǔ «fare de».
pdenisowski (הצגת פרופיל) 26 בפברואר 2012, 05:12:28
erinja:Whether something is an innovation from yesterday or from 30 years ago, it *is* an innovation, and it isn't in general use. I know many Esperantists, but sudanglo, you are one of exactly two experienced Esperantists I know who use this word.I have to agree with erinja. "Far" is non-standard usage and isn't in the Fundamento. I can't recall ever hearing this in speech or ever seeing this in a modern (last 30 years) printed book. It only appears about a dozen times in the ~1.2 million words in the Gutenburg Esperanto texts.
You're free to use it if you want but it isn't fair to suggest it to a beginner without some kind of disclaimer that some people consider this form to be wrong.
The PMEG (section 12.3.10) has a nice discussion of this. The PMEG does say that (in some rare cases) "fare de" is okay, but "far" is definitely considered a "neoficiala rolvorteto."
Amike,
Paul