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Help with 'po'

de xdzt, 29 mai 2012

Contribuții/Mesaje: 9

Limbă: English

xdzt (Arată profil) 29 mai 2012, 17:38:44

I think I understand 'po' in the context it was introduced to me (in Learning & Using), but I was wondering if this usage of the word is correct:

"Mi esperas, ke la longo de miaj afiŝoj pliiĝos po mia kapablo kaj memfido."

where I'm trying to say: "I hope that the length of my posts grow with my ability and confidence."

Initially I had "...kiel mia kapablo kaj memfido pliiĝos," but I thought 'po' was likely more correct, but I'm still not sure what is actually right.

I am trying out writing a blog in esperanto, per another user's suggestion, so I'm sorry if I end up asking too many grammar questions in the coming weeks.

darkweasel (Arată profil) 29 mai 2012, 18:45:28

Not really. I might use kune kun.

hebda999 (Arată profil) 29 mai 2012, 20:01:58

Esperanto "po" comes from Polish language and it is used exactly as in Polish:

po jednym - po unu
po dwa - po du
po trzy - po tri
po cztery - po kvar
...

It determines how many units (or how much quantity) are involved in some action. So your translation should not contain "po".

I hope that the length of my posts grow with my ability and confidence
Mi esperas, ke la longo de miaj mesaĝoj pligrandiĝas kune kun la pligrandiĝo de miaj kompetenteco kaj konfido.

Mustelvulpo (Arată profil) 29 mai 2012, 20:41:33

"Po" is used when there are multiple actions, events, prices, or rates of progress, each involving a certain number or quantity.- La instuisto donis a la lernantoj po tri krajonojn.- The teacher gave the students three pencils each. Oni vendas pomojn po duon dolaro.- The sell apples for a half-dollar each. Mi veturis po sesdek mejlojn hore.- I traveled at the rate of 60 miles per hour. (Important- NOT sesdek mejlojn po hore- which I sometimes see).

A rule of thumb- if "po" is not directly followed by a number, it is probably being used incorrectly. (There are some exceptions to this when a quantity is expressed in some other way.)

erinja (Arată profil) 29 mai 2012, 23:20:17

The rule of thumb that I generally tell English speakers is to translate po as "at a rate of" and always follow it with a number. If you do that, you won't likely go wrong.

hebda999 (Arată profil) 30 mai 2012, 06:32:37

erinja:The rule of thumb that I generally tell English speakers is to translate po as "at a rate of" and always follow it with a number. If you do that, you won't likely go wrong.
po grupe
po gute
po iom
po-parta pago
...

Miland (Arată profil) 30 mai 2012, 07:43:28

xdzt:where I'm trying to say: "I hope that the length of my posts grow with my ability and confidence."
I might put it Mi esperas, ke la grandeco de miaj mesaĝoj kreskos kune kun miaj memfido kaj posedo de la lingvo. But remember that there are often a number of ways of putting the same thing. No doubt you'll get a number of good suggestions!

sudanglo (Arată profil) 30 mai 2012, 12:03:21

Important- NOT sesdek mejlojn po hore- which I sometimes see).
Perhaps not po hore, but used as a prefix po may be followed by any sort of measure.

La pometra kosto de ĉi tiu ŝtofo, la poglasa prezo de la vino, pogranda vendado, prenu la medikamenton pogute ktp.

The difference between ni veturis cent kilometrojn en horo and ni veturis po cent kilometroj en horo is that the first tells you the distance covered in an hour, the second tells you only the speed, and leaves open how many kilometres were covered.

Personally I find Kiom da trajnoj forveturas pohore perfectly acceptable and more elegant than Po kiom da trajnoj forveturas hore (or whatever the strictly correct formulation is considered to be).

And if I can legitimately say Nia pohora rapideco atingis sesdek, why not sesdek pohore?

erinja (Arată profil) 30 mai 2012, 23:58:32

hebda999:
erinja:The rule of thumb that I generally tell English speakers is to translate po as "at a rate of" and always follow it with a number. If you do that, you won't likely go wrong.
po grupe
po gute
po iom
po-parta pago
...
As I said, you can't go wrong with following it with a number. I didn't say that this is the only possible correct formula.

However: "po iom", I would say that in this case, "iom" behaves like a number (like "kelk/" does sometimes, you could also say "po kelkaj" )

In some other cases I would say that there is an understood "unu" that isn't necessarily stated.

People get "po" wrong VERY frequently, so I think it's easier just to tell beginners "always follow it with a number", and they will get in the habit of using it correctly, and they will eventually extend their usage to other correct versions of it.

For a word like "po" that people misunderstand and misuse constantly, I'd rather give a conservative rule.

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