Missatges: 8
Llengua: English
Bruso (Mostra el perfil) 18 de gener de 2015 20.52.11
"Ĉu la knaboj estis afablaj pri ĉio ĉi tio?"
I'm not sure whether "ĉi" goes with "ĉio" or "tio", but either way it doesn't make sense: Were the boys affable concerning everything this?
Bemused (Mostra el perfil) 19 de gener de 2015 12.24.41
Bruso:This sentence is from the 1968 version of Kellerman Reed's grammar (quite different from the out-of-copyright 1910 version available on Project Gutenberg).Perhaps: Were the boys affable (polite, easy to talk to) with everything concerning this ?
"Ĉu la knaboj estis afablaj pri ĉio ĉi tio?"
I'm not sure whether "ĉi" goes with "ĉio" or "tio", but either way it doesn't make sense: Were the boys affable concerning everything this?
Lacking context this is just a wild guess.
Bruso (Mostra el perfil) 19 de gener de 2015 12.29.18
Bemused:No context. It's just a list of numbered sentences illustrating vocabulary and grammar.
Lacking context this is just a wild guess.
sudanglo (Mostra el perfil) 19 de gener de 2015 13.09.09
Ĉu la knaboj estis afablaj pri ĉio ĉi tio?There is nothing unusual about ĉio tio - meaning all that (or all this depending on context)
What is more unusual in modern Esperanto is inserting a 'ĉi', though in Zamenhofian texts your can find this. Later texts seem to use just ĉio ĉi - which makes sense as the ĉi itself has a pointing function like the ti-words.
What could be the meaning of ĉio ĉi other than all this?
nornen (Mostra el perfil) 19 de gener de 2015 20.36.09
sudanglo:I concur completely.Ĉu la knaboj estis afablaj pri ĉio ĉi tio?There is nothing unusual about ĉio tio - meaning all that (or all this depending on context)
What is more unusual in modern Esperanto is inserting a 'ĉi', though in Zamenhofian texts your can find this. Later texts seem to use just ĉio ĉi - which makes sense as the ĉi itself has a pointing function like the ti-words.
What could be the meaning of ĉio ĉi other than all this?
I start parsing at "tio" being a neutral demonstrative: this thing, that thing, yon thing.
Then I join the "ĉi" denoting proximity: this thing right here.
Then I join the "ĉio" being a quantifier: this whole thing right here, all of this abstract concept right here. Or short: all this.
Hence: Are the boys happy about all this?
As to your question: I fail to spot any semantic difference between "ĉio ĉi" and "ĉio ĉi tio" (or "ĉi ĉio" ).
Bruso (Mostra el perfil) 19 de gener de 2015 23.06.35
sudanglo:The problem I was having was that the -o tabelvortoj are treated in some sense as nouns and this looked like a noun modifying a noun, which isn't good Esperanto. So I was wondering if the ĉio and tio came from different parts of the sentence and were only together because of word-order flexibility.
What could be the meaning of ĉio ĉi other than all this?
sudanglo (Mostra el perfil) 20 de gener de 2015 11.52.23
Those words in Esperanto that don't need to carry a gramatika finaĵo (hodiaŭ, dum, tiel, pri etc) can adopt a variety of grammatical roles.
But in any case the linking of 'nouns' is not unknown in Esperanto.
En la urbo Parizo ...; la internacia lingvo Esperanto
Mi forsendis lin, la sentaŭgulon
Saluton Sinjoro Profesoro
Nia Prezidanto, amiko al ĉiuj, ...
Mi ricevis doublan pagon, dek frankojn
and in a compound word: La venonta Esperanto-kongreso.
As to whether ĉio and tio could stand together but 'come from different parts of the sentence', I am at a loss to think of a good example.
sudanglo (Mostra el perfil) 20 de gener de 2015 11.52.23