I don't think I've fully got my brain around when I need to use what - especially between ĉe and apud. I think I might have even come across another one that means a similar thing.

I get that apud is more literal? I think? But I get the impression ĉe can be both literal and figurative.

I'm just confused! If anyone can simplify this for me at all...

If you visit me, while you are in my house you are "ĉe mi". If we meet in Lille - I hope to be there - and we are standing in the UK next to each other you are "apud mi". Of course, you could be in my house standing next to me and then you would be "apud mi ĉe mi" but if we were in your house standing side-by-side, then you could be said to be "apud mi ĉe vi". Sound reasonable?

robbkvasnak:If you visit me, while you are in my house you are "ĉe mi". If we meet in Lille - I hope to be there - and we are standing in the UK next to each other you are "apud mi". Of course, you could be in my house standing next to me and then you would be "apud mi ĉe mi" but if we were in your house standing side-by-side, then you could be said to be "apud mi ĉe vi". Sound reasonable?

There may even be another good explanation, but yours is excellent, because you just described the nuance of both words.

Rujo:

robbkvasnak:If you visit me, while you are in my house you are "ĉe mi". If we meet in Lille - I hope to be there - and we are standing in the UK next to each other you are "apud mi". Of course, you could be in my house standing next to me and then you would be "apud mi ĉe mi" but if we were in your house standing side-by-side, then you could be said to be "apud mi ĉe vi". Sound reasonable?

There may even be another good explanation, but yours is excellent, because you just described the nuance of both words.

Good explanation, yes. I do see the OP's point, though, and one is more 'literal' and the other 'figurative,' but yes the nuance is nicely elucidated by the above example. A further clarification which may be helpful, I shall provide here:

RULE:
To me, ĉe is the more general term which means in the vicinity, over some short or long duration of time, of a person or an owned or conventionally described location, while apud is the more literal term which means currently beside at the time indicated by the sentence, as in, an observer could consider them literally paired or grouped together. Were they moving around separately but in the same location/place, they would still both be ĉe that location/place and ĉe each other. but when and while they walk around side by side, then they are apud each other.

[I erased my figurative discussion, after consulting the PMEG. It seems there are confusions about ĉe, and I fell victim to one. This ĉe versus apud nuance, should be given more attention, so that we all can more clearly understand the boundaries of its use. Thanks for reading.]

Thank you all!

Rujo:

robbkvasnak:If you visit me, while you are in my house you are "ĉe mi". If we meet in Lille - I hope to be there - and we are standing in the UK next to each other you are "apud mi". Of course, you could be in my house standing next to me and then you would be "apud mi ĉe mi" but if we were in your house standing side-by-side, then you could be said to be "apud mi ĉe vi". Sound reasonable?

There may even be another good explanation, but yours is excellent, because you just described the nuance of both words.

This is extremely useful, I am saving this explanation!

I think I also have an idea now about similar usages in other languages which I find helps me remember, too.

Dankon!