Vestitor:

Alkanadi:

Vestitor:

Alkanadi:
You deserve unlimited freedom until you use it to hurt someone.

This, however, is utilitarian idealism, and idealism never transfers neatly to complicated reality.

I am asking this out of curiosity. In what situation does this not apply?

Perhaps in a situation when you don't really know you're hurting someone? Or is it that we know everyone's true feelings and motives? The effects of unwitting behaviour are also harmful.

Can you give a specific example?

Vestitor:

Alkanadi:

Vestitor:

Alkanadi:
You deserve unlimited freedom until you use it to hurt someone.

This, however, is utilitarian idealism, and idealism never transfers neatly to complicated reality.

I am asking this out of curiosity. In what situation does this not apply?

Perhaps in a situation when you don't really know you're hurting someone? Or is it that we know everyone's true feelings and motives? The effects of unwitting behaviour are also harmful.

I don't really want to embark on the philosophical unravelling of all this though; I'm a bit tired of the topic.

I mean, yes, the consenting adults model applies to polyamory. You do have to ask your partners how they feel, and sometimes their feelings will change, or worse they will be less than honest.

Of course, none of that is different from monogamy, apart from partner becoming singular.

Demian:...

Uh - being polyamorous is now being compared to blowing people up?

I think we need a reality check here, guys. Seriously.

Tempodivalse:

Demian:...

Uh - being polyamorous is now being compared to blowing people up?

I think we need a reality check here, guys. Seriously.

That's very out of context. He was referring to the ability to make comment upon other people's decisions. An extreme example maybe.

Alkanadi:

You deserve unlimited freedom until you use it to hurt someone.

This is the problem with such simplistic sound bites.

No matter what you do, SOMEbody is going to be "hurt" by something you do or say. So what does this lead to? complete paralysis of act and word is what. Total antithesis of "freedom" wouldn't thee say?

I mean look at me. By thy "until you use it to hurt someone" I don't even have the freedom to practice my own religious beliefs not because it breaks someone's arm, or blinds them, or even makes them stub their toe but because it hurts some delicate little snowflake's feelings. Well, sorry but as I've said before, my right to practice my religion trumps someone else's supposed freedom to not be offended. One of those is spelled out in the constitution, the other is not.

orthohawk1:

Alkanadi:

You deserve unlimited freedom until you use it to hurt someone.

This is the problem with such simplistic sound bites.

No matter what you do, SOMEbody is going to be "hurt" by something you do or say. So what does this lead to? complete paralysis of act and word is what. Total antithesis of "freedom" wouldn't thee say?

I mean look at me. By thy "until you use it to hurt someone" I don't even have the freedom to practice my own religious beliefs not because it breaks someone's arm, or blinds them, or even makes them stub their toe but because it hurts some delicate little snowflake's feelings. Well, sorry but as I've said before, my right to practice my religion trumps someone else's supposed freedom to not be offended. One of those is spelled out in the constitution, the other is not.

Another example of this phenomenon is when someone melts down because they're asked to respect boundaries, resorts to anti-Semitic slurs, melts down, plays the victim when they refuse to give a proper apology, and then alludes to a distorted version of the whole incident at every available opportunity for weeks. Give it a rest.

I get really sick of people asking "Why do people have to make up a name for X thing? Why can't they just see that it's normal and stop making a big deal about it/trying to pretend it's an identity?"

I already saw someone in this thread say something along those lines for both asexuality and polyamory.

People come up with names for things that describe them, because they want to connect with other people. They want to define their identity. They want some visiblity and legitimacy. Who makes you the judge of what groups of people are worthy of having a name and a community, and which aren't?

whysea:I get really sick of people asking "Why do people have to make up a name for X thing? Why can't they just see that it's normal and stop making a big deal about it/trying to pretend it's an identity?"

I already saw someone in this thread say something along those lines for both asexuality and polyamory.

People come up with names for things that describe them, because they want to connect with other people. They want to define their identity. They want some visiblity and legitimacy. Who makes you the judge of what groups of people are worthy of having a name and a community, and which aren't?

I might addend to this that this is a language forum, no less. "Why do people want words?" asks people on a forum for learning a new language.

rikforto:Another example of this phenomenon is when someone melts down because they're asked to respect boundaries, resorts to anti-Semitic slurs, melts down, plays the victim when they refuse to give a proper apology, and then alludes to a distorted version of the whole incident at every available opportunity for weeks. Give it a rest.

But don't you think it's charming to read comments from people who think they have constitutional freedoms of speech on a privately-run web forums?

erinja:

rikforto:Another example of this phenomenon is when someone melts down because they're asked to respect boundaries, resorts to anti-Semitic slurs, melts down, plays the victim when they refuse to give a proper apology, and then alludes to a distorted version of the whole incident at every available opportunity for weeks. Give it a rest.

But don't you think it's charming to read comments from people who think they have constitutional freedoms of speech on a privately-run web forums?

Normally it's one of my hobby-horses, actually! I hit send and regretted forgetting to mention that immediately, but decided to let it be. I'm glad someone else got there.