Mesaĝoj: 16
Lingvo: English
richardhall (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-12 15:48:16
"When the banner is unfurled, all reason is in the trumpet"
I'd be grateful for any thoughts...
mnlg (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-12 18:05:52
Kiam flago etendiĝ[ad]as, trumpeto tenas racion.
A nice proverb, by the way. I like flags a lot, but I dislike their overuse.
richardhall (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-12 23:38:05
If I pressed you, would you choose etendigxas or etendigxadas? And why, of course!
mnlg:Here's my attempt. Perhaps too literal, but you might use it as a start:
Kiam flago etendiĝ[ad]as, trumpeto tenas racion.
A nice proverb, by the way. I like flags a lot, but I dislike their overuse.
mnlg (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 00:23:49
richardhall:Thanks for that. I like the way you've approached it.Thank you!
If I pressed you, would you choose etendigxas or etendigxadas?Either.
And why, of course!Why not?
I would perhaps use the form in -adas. In its English version, the proverb is phrased in the passive ("is unfurled") but it strikes me as very active. It is not about the occasional flag flying by itself, but the conscious action of unfurling, i.e., the ubiquitous or frequent recourse to flags, that is seen as a potential source of concern. I still think there might very well be better ways to express that in Esperanto, but if I really had to keep to my first attempt, that's what I would do.
richardhall (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 12:05:56
mnlg:I would perhaps use the form in -adas. In its English version, the proverb is phrased in the passive ("is unfurled") but it strikes me as very active. It is not about the occasional flag flying by itself, but the conscious action of unfurling, i.e., the ubiquitous or frequent recourse to flags, that is seen as a potential source of concern. I still think there might very well be better ways to express that in Esperanto, but if I really had to keep to my first attempt, that's what I would do.I suppose it must be possible to use 'unfurl' in the active voice in English, I don't think I've ever heard it used that way. (And I've never come across the verb "to furl" either, possibly because I move in the wrong circles
) Anyway, your reasoning for choosing the -ad- form was very clear and helpful. Thanks again. 
erinja (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 14:40:28
richardhall (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 15:57:25
erinja:I have only seen "furl" in the context of sailing, where people still talk about furling sails.
leonarde (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 21:34:03
mnlg:The use of entendiĝi in this translation would seem reasonable based on its building blocks, but, put together, they apparently add up to something else. Based on the lernu.net dictionary, etendiĝi means "to run" or "to span," not "to become extended" or "to become stretched out" as we would expect it to. My question is, what does it mean to "run" or "span" in the context of this word, and what is the real way to say "unfurl"?
Kiam flago etendiĝ[ad]as, trumpeto tenas racion.
mnlg (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 21:42:53
La maro etendiĝas ĝis la horizonto.
and I think it might reply to your question.
leonarde (Montri la profilon) 2008-februaro-13 22:21:35
mnlg:This use seems to be more in line with "span" than "unfurl."
La maro etendiĝas ĝis la horizonto.
How does "malpakiĝi" (to become unpacked) work? Or maybe "malenpakiĝi" (to become unwrapped/unravelled/unpacked)? Do these suggested terms seem more or less accurage than "entendiĝi"?