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Cause of eternal beginners

Alkanadi, 2016 m. birželis 19 d.

Žinutės: 118

Kalba: English

Alkanadi (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 19 d. 09:46:07

Why do some people get stuck as eternal beginners?

ludomastro (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 19 d. 13:43:07

Alkanadi:Why do some people get stuck as eternal beginners?
I can't speak to everyone's reasons. My first foray into Esperanto ended at the beginner level because I had no one to practice with. As a married man - and being a little older than the target audience for Pasporta Servo - I didn't see how to use Esperanto in travel. Thus I had little incentive to practice. Thus, the downward spiral continued.

I imagine that for most folks it's a combination of lack of support and the fact that most of us will try something only to give up once there's the normal resistance of actually doing the thing. Taking up archery is easy. Getting good at it? Not so much.

That's my two cents, any way.

johmue (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 20 d. 06:51:51

Alkanadi:Why do some people get stuck as eternal beginners?
I know people who are doing Esperanto only to have some kind of mental gymnastics. They have no intention to get fluent and to use Esperanto in real life. And that's ok.

There are very few, who for some reason show up regularly on Esperanto events and expect everyone there to speak their language with them. They are annoying but it's so few of them, that they are ignorable.

Alkanadi (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 20 d. 08:30:15

johmue:There are very few, who for some reason show up regularly on Esperanto events and expect everyone there to speak their language with them.
Interesting. Maybe, they just like the concept of a universal language but don't want to learn it.

Sunjo (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 20 d. 10:35:58

Alkanadi:Why do some people get stuck as eternal beginners?
Sometimes I believe it is because they are afraid of using Esperanto or at least prefer using their native language even on websites like lernu.net lango.gif

Alkanadi (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 20 d. 10:51:04

Sunjo:...or at least prefer using their native language even on websites like lernu.net lango.gif
I do that. I am on en.lernu.net. I think I am now good enough to make the switch to eo.lernu.net. I will give it a try.

erinja (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 20 d. 13:56:54

Same as the cause for an eternal beginner in anything. That guy who has learned to crochet five times but still does not know how to crochet. We all know "that guy" or "that woman" in any task that requires some practice to become skillful. Learning a language or a skill takes time. Some people will try for a short time then drop it entirely and move on to something else, some will keep working and practicing until they become skilled. And there will always be a subset of people who start something and enjoy it enough to continue it at a minimal level, never working at it enough to become skilled but still not dropping it entirely.

It's especially true for languages, where a minimal level can get you a certain distance but progressing beyond that minimal level takes time and effort. I have met a lot of eternal beginners for a lot of languages, and I'd probably consider myself an eternal beginner for at least two languages that I speak to some minimal degree.

Alkanadi (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 21 d. 08:18:40

erinja:It's especially true for languages, where a minimal level can get you a certain distance but progressing beyond that minimal level takes time and effort.
So you would put the onus on the learner?

I had a feeling that most people would take this position. I definitely put some onus on the learner as well. However, I am more likely to blame the learning tools than the learner.

I was getting so bored with Esperanto until Duolingo came along. However, Duolingo is only a drop in the ocean compared to what is possible.

Vestitor (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 21 d. 10:22:54

Outside of formal instruction a great deal of the onus is assuredly on the learner. The availability of different kinds of learning materials, since the middle of last century (often using the best multimedia available at the time), has allowed people to learn languages through a combination of whatever methods are employed and a lot of perseverance by the learner. Isn't perseverance a factor in almost any skill acquisition?

The argument that the tools can be improved has been going on for ages. It has some truth in it too because materials like audio recordings and video have certainly helped. However there are also people who have everything on offer and still only make slow progress. There is also the capacity of the learner to consider. Even with something as relatively simple as Esperanto there will be variable results for different people.

I've met many people who want to learn something and they buy all the books and even sign up for classes, but it doesn't always work. The instruction can't always be faulted because other people in the classes have succeeded and progressed.

You can lead a horse to water...

Alkanadi (Rodyti profilį) 2016 m. birželis 21 d. 10:35:25

Vestitor:You can lead a horse to water...
But if the water is a small muddy pond full of sewage then the horse will be disappointed.

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