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Graphic Novels

fra Tidalias,2008 9 12

Meldinger: 146

Språk: English

Tidalias (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 6 17:02:33

@James: Still working my way through all those tasks over the next year, so thanks for the well-wishings. ridulo.gif

In an idle googling of 'esperanto subtitles', I've just found subtitles for Spirited Away and thought they may serve some purpose to the users in this thread for the 'seeing what others before you have done' advice. I've only watched a few minutes of my copy with the subtitles loaded in, but they seem to work fine. Of course, I'm far too rusty to know how well-translated it is, but it seems alright on the surface and there may be some good examples of how the author (Pablo Morales, apparently?) handled certain aspects of the Japanese to Esperanto challenges.
http://subscene.com/esperanto/spirited-away-sen-...

There may be more examples in the list of subtitles I found, or someone may just find the list personally useful:
http://www.all4divx.com/subtitles/allmovies/Espe...

Edit: One problem I'm seeing is that any Esperanto characters with accents seem to be changing to bizarre ones in my VLC, but that could be an issue with my computer.

Edit edit: Okay, so what was at first just five minutes of watching to determine subtitle functionality turned into me getting absorbed and watching the whole movie again. The aforementioned issues I had with accented characters made it difficult to reason out what some words were originally supposed to be, but overall I found it well-done from my unpolished perspective. Maybe someone else will take interest and give it a look as well.

Edit yet again:

Found a few others-

Grave of the Fireflies
http://subscene.com/esperanto/grave-of-the-firefli...

Howl's Moving Castle
http://subscene.com/esperanto/Howls-Moving-Castle-...

Princess Mononoke
http://subscene.com/esperanto/Princess-Mononoke-Mo...

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 7 09:16:56

Ah I getcha now LizTyphone, so basically translating those things that we have translated in English, from things such as "Copic marker" (I love my copic markers!) to rendering things like accents (e.g. how kansai dialect is often rendered as a deep-southern US accent in English media)?

And cheers Tidalias for those links, I might have a look at spirited away if I ever get the chance, even if I don't tend to watch Gibli films.

Oŝo-Jabe (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 8 02:48:16

There are certain polite phrases that should have a consistent translation.

For example:
Itadakimasu - Dankon pro la manĝ(aĵ)o
--Gochisousama - Mi ĝuis la manĝ(aĵ)on (?)
Ittekimasu - Ĝis la revido
--Itterasshai - Ĝis tiam
Shitsurei shimasu - Pardonu
Ojama shimasu - Pardonu la entrudon
Osaki ni (shitsurei shimasu) - Pardonu la fruan eliron
Irrashaimase - Jen eminentulo./Bonvenon./Eminentulo ĉestas. (?)
Omatase shimashita (or just Omatase) - Pardonu la atendon
Matte kudasai - Atendu, mi petas.

I think we should translate other common (non-polite) phrases on a case by case basis. If we try too hard to keep Japanese word order or sentence constructions we risk making the Esperanto translation sound awkward, with "translation artifacts."

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 8 09:22:49

I like the translations Oŝo-jabe!
One thing I found awkward was Itadakimasu, because when translated to most European languages it sounds awkward - After all, if I'm correct, it's like saying grace at a Christian Western dinner table - it's that reoccurring table etiquette thing done just before eating, where as 'dankon pro la manĝaĵo' sounds like you're saying thank you to someone for giving you food (where arigatou gozaimasu (grandan dankon) would probably be better in Japanese). But then again Itadakimasu has always been a problem with translation

jchthys (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 8 14:33:10

How about bonan apetiton, or is that totally off?

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 8 15:06:13

jchthys:How about bonan apetiton, or is that totally off?
Mmm that's not bad, problem is it's something you normally say aimed at someone else, not necessarily yourself.. Is there an EO translation for 'Let's dig in'? lango.gif

EDIT: Maybe something like "Bongustega!" could be used on the odd occasion, especially when the food actually looks good lango.gif? E.g. situations where Tenma (from school rumble) is NOT involved

LyzTyphone (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 8 17:27:42

@Oŝo-Jabe
Good call!

Since Itadakimasu means "(I) receive/eat now...", translated directly it will be "Mi ekmanĝas!" (and by pure coincidence their endings sound similar). Ok that makes little sense.

Actually I still think "Dankon" will be an appropriate solution. Since it is shown here that Itadakimasu "is said to express gratitude for all who had a part in preparing the food". Like I have been in one of those family whose grace is like "God is great, God is good. Let us thank Him for our food. Amen". (I like it pretty much because it rhymes~!) In this grace they are indeed thanking someone (God) for their food, even if it's just etiquette.
This expression actually stems from Buddhism, making it even more like the grace.

Also, about "Irassyaimase", please read the bottom of this page and you will find that it actually means "Please come in! ". So, I guess "Bonvenon" will suffice.

Also, I feel that we don't actually need to specify everything we are "pardonu"-ing for...
How do you guys feel about this "Ojama shimasu - Pardonu"?

erinja (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 9 00:34:31

Culturally, Esperanto speakers are inclined to say "bonan apetiton" before they eat. For some Esperanto speakers, you might be considered rude if you didn't say it before you started eating. People don't hold to this very strongly in the US (culturally we are not used to saying anything before we eat) but I have noticed that saying something is widespread in Europe.

I would say that bonan apetiton is a good choice, even though it is directed at others. After all, everyone says it, so in some sense, each person is saying it for themselves!

ceigered (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 9 06:08:51

erinja:Culturally, Esperanto speakers are inclined to say "bonan apetiton" before they eat. For some Esperanto speakers, you might be considered rude if you didn't say it before you started eating. People don't hold to this very strongly in the US (culturally we are not used to saying anything before we eat) but I have noticed that saying something is widespread in Europe.

I would say that bonan apetiton is a good choice, even though it is directed at others. After all, everyone says it, so in some sense, each person is saying it for themselves!
Rightio, I'm now converted then (to the bonan apetiton cause). In Australia we just dig in most of the time before anyone else starts eating lango.gif

It looks like Itadakimasu can be translated a number of ways, all of which may be quite useful...

LyzTyphone (Å vise profilen) 2009 9 9 16:49:50

@erinja
I see! Thank you so much for your advice! To tell the truth, almost everyone of the translators here is a manga-fan and has great love for Japanese Manga culture. But that great love sometimes leads me to overrate the uniqueness of some Japanese expression. That's when the advice from someone outside this circle becomes important. Thank you for helping us avoid Japanismo!

@Tidalias
Thank you for those subs! I wish I also have the movies stored in my hard disk, but yeah they do help~

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Oh I should go make some progress~~ That's the best way to find new problems

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