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Translation of Names

by Caledaravel, March 20, 2007

Messages: 39

Language: English

Caledaravel (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 1:36:45 AM

Let's say my name has an unvoiced "th" sound in it. How would that be pronounced in Esperanto? Or would it change to a different letter or combination thereof?

I hope this isn't a stupid question. shoko.gif

~Caledaravel

Islander (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 2:30:34 PM

Unless your name is "The Masked Marvel", I can't see what names would have such a sound. Names Like Thomas or Catherine have a mute H and would translate into Tomaso and Katarina (I think).

erinja (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 2:49:05 PM

Usually an unvoiced th is written as a simple t.

So "Ethan" might be "Etano".

"Jonathan" might be "Jonatano"

(both of those names, interestingly, have their Esperanto versions close to Hebrew versions - "Eitan" and "Yonatan")

Not sure what would be done with a voiced th though, maybe a Z? Some Welsh names have that sound but I don't know what they are in Esperanto.

(Btw, Islander - the h in Catherine is not mute in English, the th is pronounced like the th in "math")

Islander (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 3:02:59 PM

(Btw, Islander - the h in Catherine is not mute in English, the th is pronounce like the th in "math")
That's probably because I'm a french speaker, but I don't pronouced the H in math either! rido.gif I have to admit the TH is a complete non-sense for french speaker and a nightmare trying to do it. I still remember grade school were the teacher had us practicing this for days.. No, no... from the tip of your tongue like this: Zzzza... No, more like Dhha, Zlea, vloa, no, no... Aaargh!
Not sure what would be done with a voiced th though, maybe a Z?
As with the provided examples and as it appears to do in Romance based laguages, I beleive it would simply become mute and therefore non-existent in Esperanto.

erinja (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 8:18:59 PM

Islander: I have to admit the TH is a complete non-sense for french speaker and a nightmare trying to do it. I still remember grade school were the teacher had us practicing this for days.. No, no... from the tip of your tongue like this: Zzzza... No, more like Dhha, Zlea, vloa, no, no... Aaargh!
Have you got it now? The best "trick" I ever heard is that you have to put your tongue *between* your teeth, lightly close your teeth around your tongue and blow. Without sticking your tongue between your teeth you will almost certainly not get it.

Islander (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 8:43:31 PM

Have you got it now?
Not really and I'm not really trying much anyway. It ends up just being an accent and most people find it cute (unless the word "third" needs to be used... lots of fun on that one...)

Islander (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 9:01:31 PM

I don't understand...why is it so hard to pronounce...
As a toddler grows and practice a specific language, it's throat, mouth and tongue adapt to ease the sounds used in that language. Once you reach pre-teens, that gets set and it becomes harder and harder to do certain sounds your not used to, and as there is no comparable sounds in french, that's hard for us. Just as much as certain German or Arabic sounds may be for english speakers.

I'm sure you have seen some movies with french people speaking english: "Ziss iss haw zey speek" (and that's not an holywood cliché).

pastorant (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 11:45:10 PM

I have always had a gift for languages. For example, last week I went to my barber and he had a new Georgian barber working there.
So I belted out
Gamarjoba! Ragora khar? გამარჯობა! რაგორა ხარ?
But that's all I know, except maybe a couple of words.! (I'm a good mimic). He started speaking rapid fire Georgian! He sounded so excited that another native was there!
I told him that was all I knew, and he said I spoke Georgian with an Abkhaz accent. I came back the next day and brought him the CD's I learned Georgian from and he said the speaker was Abkhaz! I speak Spanish with a Peruvian accent (because my childhood friends were from Lima) and I learned Russian from a girl from Minsk, so I speak Russian with a Byelorussian accent. I can detect accents easily as well, and I can consciously switch accents if I try.
Foreigners tend to think I'm native when I'm not. Although I think French is easy to pronounce for me, I choose not to pronounce French with a Quebecois accent. Sorry, but I don't like it. I think it's too rough lango.gif

DesertNaiad (User's profile) March 20, 2007, 11:47:14 PM

I too have trouble with the sound of c in Esperanto, and my rolling r trips my tongue a lot. I'll be reading a lesson aloud, run into a c and have to say "tsar, like in tsar!" a few times before I can pronounce the new word. H and ĥ are harder for me than either c or r though. I can't even hear the difference most of the time, yet.

Islander (User's profile) March 21, 2007, 12:01:14 AM

Foreigners tend to think I'm native when I'm not.
I'm fluent enough now that I often get that too when I speak english. Native speaker will comment that I have an accent, but they rarely think it's french. I've heard I sounded spanish a lot, I even heard arabic once!
I choose not to pronounce French with a Quebecois accent.
As gifted as you may be, I'll guaranty you if you're not fully integrated into Québec's community, you just cannot fully grasp the dialect and the regional accents. Speaking an "international" french while here will work out much better in this case.
H and ĥ are harder for me than either c or r though. I can't even hear the difference most of the time, yet.
Well, since I can't even grasp the english H, you can imagine the fun I'm having here! And I was reading the comparative examples on how to pronouce it in the grammar here and it just confused me even more. The best way for me to reproduce the sound is to try to pronouce a K but inspiring instead of expiring air. It works for the letter alone, but it sure is hard to do a whole word after that!

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