qwertz:

Rogir:I think you misunderstand. Exactly because Hitler was against Esperanto, some people who do not like him learn Esperanto.

Probably people who just studying propaganda material of this persons and don't have any interest in the historical follow-ups of this material to take care of their "fascination balance". I assume they also study KKK propaganda material to find some motivation learning Esperanto(?), isn't it? For me, it's quite shocking that people get fascinated again of this propaganda material and can grab motivation learning esperanto from the hate of a manic fanatic. In my opinion, they have never seen pictures of piles of deathly famished etc. bodies and don't know what Zyclon-B means. This person should visit one of the european concentration camp memorials to get a glue that this topic isn't really funny due to it's short time distance it happened.

It's not because ZOV read mein Kampf that it means she is a nazi. There is a difference between getting informed and Believing in what you read.

I personnally do not believe in God, but I have read the Coran, and (tried to) read the Bible, because I wanted to understand.

Honestly, even I as an Austrian don't understand qwertz's viewpoint. Nobody said that any of Hitler's political viewpoints, or murder orders, were good. Only that Hitler's hate of Esperanto has, today, drawn somebody to Esperanto, as it gave Esperanto some publicity.

Why shouldn't one read Mein Kampf if one wants to know about Hitler's viewpoints? I believe that the Nazi period is one of the most interesting historical periods. So why not read about it? Amn't(*) I allowed to read something that I disagree with? Would you also attack somebody who read a text by Caesar, who killed a lot of Roman enemies and turned Rome into a dictatorship too?

(*) Why isn't this word standard English, btw?

jan aleksan:
It's not because ZOV read mein Kampf that it means she is a nazi. There is a difference between getting informed and Believing in what you read.

No, I did not say that everybody reading this special propaganda material is a nazi. I don't wanna say that! There are lots of sciences reasons to read that stuff. But, just read the topic header of this thread. It sounds like one of this silly advertisements for anything else. But H. "brought a lot of people into a zyklon-B gas room". And not any happiness. Contrary to Esperanto which was intented by Zamenhof bringing people together. Even if some people find motivation inside this propaganda material to learn Esperanto they should stay apart use the "bla, bla, bla brought me to bla, bla, bla.." advertising slang.

jan aleksan:
I personnally do not believe in God, but I have read the Coran, and (tried to) read the Bible, because I wanted to understand.

I respect that really. And I respect the religion of other people as long the don't enforce or try to migrate me to their religion rules.

darkweasel:Honestly, even I as an Austrian don't understand qwertz's viewpoint. Nobody said that any of Hitler's political viewpoints, or murder orders, were good.

Even the german far right persons would not say that in the german public. They would be arrested for that. That's a german law made by german after WW2 democrats. This punishment also includes the public display of the nazi svastika. Right now I live in Munich which was one of the big nazi center between 1933 and 1945 (Braune Haus) and the next concentration camp memorial is located nearby Munich in Dachau. And far right's also distribute the Schulhof-CD(far right schoolcourt-cd-rom propaganda). They do it whole Germany. So there is no need for "H. brought me to etc.". They still utilized Esperanto to protect the german language in the past. (Some german esperantistoj used these stategy to spread esperanto but they didn't intended to help the far right's.)

To stop here I only wanna mention that Munich city government decided to build a special centre for the history of national socialism next year to present a non-funny objective historical view at this dark (city) history.

darkweasel:
Only that Hitler's hate of Esperanto has, today, drawn somebody to Esperanto, as it gave Esperanto some publicity.

Okej, I have to accept that. But I'm far away to understand that. So, shocking for me but seems to be that H.'s M.K. brought people to Esperanto. Okej. No worries. I will try to cool down.

Miland:Walt Disney made a very funny Donald Duck cartoon poking fun at Hitler and the Nazis during WWII called Der Fuehrer's Face.

This propaganda cartoon was made in 1943, during Stalingrad Battle, III reich was at its peak.
Officialy, anybody knew what was going on, in occupied territories, but you know it now, nothing good!

qwertz:
Even the german far right persons would not say that in the german public. They would be arrested for that. That's a german law made by german after WW2 democrats. This punishment also includes the public display of the nazi svastika.

I know. That's what Germans (and Austrians btw, we're no better) call free speech.

darkweasel:Why shouldn't one read Mein Kampf if one wants to know about Hitler's viewpoints?

Here's my $0.02 on that subject...

I recently read a book called "10 Books that Screwed Up the World" by Benjamin Wiker, PhD. The author's viewpoint, and I'm paraphrasing, is that there are good and bad ideas that have entered into the world and spread through civilization like viruses. The main way of spreading these ideas has traditionally been through books. The author lists the books he considers to have been the most dangerous because their infection has caused society the most damage, from his opinion. (And yes, "Mein Kampf" is one of the books on the list)

In spite of calling these books "dangerous viruses", Dr Wiker makes a very strong case against their censorship. His feeling is that these ideas are already loose in the world and still creating damage. The genie won't go back in the bottle. Therefore, the way to counter and fight against them is to understand their origins, recognize any of their permutations that have infected modern thought, and develop reasoned arguments to counter them. To this end, he encourages people to read all of the books that he lists to accomplish this goal.

I feel this is a very powerful and well reasoned argument. Any thoughts?

andogigi: Therefore, the way to counter and fight against them is to understand their origins, recognize any of their permutations that have infected modern thought, and develop reasoned arguments to counter them. To this end, he encourages people to read all of the books that he lists to accomplish this goal.

I feel this is a very powerful and well reasoned argument. Any thoughts?

Yes, I know what you mean. For the Schulhof-CD spreaded by some german far right persons at public school courts excist a counterpart reasoning recommendation for teacher. Before creating such recommendations somebody has to read and hear this material. But generally, there excist rules for proper working democracy. And that rule set should include rules against (public) hate-varbado against other people.

#1 (pdf, german); #2(pdf,german)

I wonder what are the nine others: The bible and Coran? the red book? the evolution of species?

darkweasel:Amn't(*)

(*) Why isn't this word standard English, btw?

It was, then it turned into "ain't", then people expanded its meaning, and some claimed it was bad grammar. They ruined it for everyone! Now we have to live with "Aren't I?" for "I am not." instead of the far more logical "Ain't I?"

jan aleksan:I wonder what are the nine others: The bible and Coran? the red book? the evolution of species?

Have the Holy Bible or the Glorious Qur'an screwed up the world? I would think some commentary on those books or the tradition that developed around them is more dangerous than the books themselves or the ideas they contain, it takes a little bit of doing to get from "Thou shall not kill" and "Love thy neighbor" to the Crusades or the Spanish Inquisition.

As for the Little Red Book, while widely read in China, it was probably less influential worldwide than other Marxist inspired works, or even the "Communist Manifesto" itself (which makes it on the list.)

You got close with the last guess, though. The author considered Darwin's "The Descent of Man" to be one of those books. The description of the book here, lists the books.