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Miland (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 14.33.56
greenmanwitch:It may be time for you to take a look at the 'appreciation' you're getting...Yes, as I explained your 'appreciation' merits a warning.
greenmanwitch (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 14.36.48
Miland:Vi rememorigas min pri Jayant Patel, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jayant_Patel . Vi estas kvazaŭ la Esperanto-gramatikista versio de li.mihxil:Why do you think 'la' is called a 'difinilo' and not a 'specifilo'?I think I've explained my position enough. I don't think it's worthwhile to continue this debate.
Vi buĉas la lingvon pro malkompetenteco.
mihxil (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 14.46.12
Miland:It is indeed clear enough. More or less like thismihxil:Why do you think 'la' is called a 'difinilo' and not a 'specifilo'?I think I've explained my position enough. I don't think it's worthwhile to continue this debate.
sudanglo (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 14.47.38
I've lost the thread now. Have I won?
The Polar Express is a charming film. I was enchanted when I saw it on French TV. When I saw it later in English it didn't seeem to have quite the same magic. Funny, that.
But also the French version of 'The Little Princess' I found better, more Winnie-the-Pooh-ish, if you see what I mean. In the English version the accents jarred.
I know that has nothing to do with 'What time is it?' - but then the whole thread has lost it way.
erinja (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 14.56.32
Fyi I am dealing with the off-colour postings.
Sudanglo -- yes, you've won! Stop by our Prize Headquarters anytime to claim your reward.
Re: A little princess - You must be referring to the New York version. I found it weirdly jarring as well. I didn't really see why they had to change the original story and make it American.
Miland (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 15.39.18
sudanglo:The Polar Express is a charming film. I was enchanted when I saw it on French TV. When I saw it later in English it didn't seeem to have quite the same magic. Funny, that..I suppose it could be the 'first time' effect, but just try the 3-D version in an IMAX theatre (though the ones across the Channel may be nearer you if you're on the South coast).
Miland (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 15.43.02
erinja:I plan to make some lovely quince-based desserts this weekend.I've read that quinces are inedible unless they are cooked in some way. Can they be used in the way that apples are in apple pies, or are they only suitable for quince jam tarts or flavourings?
mihxil (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 16.26.31
Well, in that case I have another little remark. It is at least still related to the topic. Perhaps it pours some fresh oil into the flames.
But I don 't mean to. Everything what I'm going to say is because of purely academic interest.
While thinking about it, it occurred to me that using ordinals to indicate the time of the day is not very sensible at all. Or at least very outdated.
What would e.g. be the first hour of the day? That would be from 0:00 to 01:00. So, if somebody asks at 9:05 the howmanieth hour it is, I can quite logically answer that it is the tenth hour.
It is similar to how we name centuries. The 21st century is from 2000 (or 2001) to 2100. It is the 21st century, because that is the one that is currently being 'active'.
The same, by the way, is or at least was valid for years themselves (which is proven by the fact that according to most calendars there is no year 0). But for years it is clear that we no longer think of them as ordinals, but as mere labels. The year 2010 is not the twothousand-and-tenth year, but it is simply the year we call '2010'.
In the languages I know you don't use ordinals for the time of the day. I don't know how Esperanto ended up with this rather archaic looking system. Perhaps it comes from hebrew, as I now that at least in the bible the time is indicated as for example 'the ninth hour' (which would btw mean in the afternoon). It seems to be a system of people who didn't invent the zero yet.
So consicely, in esperanto you say at 8:05 that it is 'la oka horo kaj kvin minutoj' and it seems that I actually don't quite understand that construction. It's probably mostly idiomatic, but it interests me any way.
Chainy (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 16.53.43
mihxil:What would e.g. be the first hour of the day? That would be from 0:00 to 01:00. So, if somebody asks at 9:05 the howmanieth hour it is, I can quite logically answer that it is the tenth hour.Following this line of thought, I suppose if we're using ordinals, then for 08:05, we should probably say 'kvin minutoj de la naŭa horo'! By the way, you say it that way in Russian. Maybe that's where the root of the idea was in Zamenhof's head, which caused him to use the ordinals. But then he decided to change things a bit, so that speakers of German, English (I'm not sure about other languages) etc wouldn't get too confused with such a system... so he ended up calling it 'la oka horo kaj kvin minutoj' - maybe during the transition he forgot to get rid of the ordinal!
Mere speculation, but it's a funny idea.Note: In Russian, the time is quite interesting. For 10:00, they wouldn't use the ordinal, but say it a similar way to English (in Esperanto a literal translation would be 'Estas dek horoj'), but then for 10:05, you'd say '5 minutes of 11'. It often confused me, when I heard in Russia that it's 'it's already the tenth hour', when the time could be 21.05 or 21.10 for example... In English, we'd say 'it's already past nine o'clock'.
erinja (Tunjukkan profil) 14 Oktober 2010 17.51.21
Miland:I've read that quinces are inedible unless they are cooked in some way. Can they be used in the way that apples are in apple pies, or are they only suitable for quince jam tarts or flavourings?They are extremely tart and can be bitter uncooked. You can use them like apples in pies. I plan to use half of my haul to make a quince tarte tatin (so that's like your apple pie example) and half to make quince jelly candies (in the line of your jam tarts, since I'll be cooking them to a mush and then cooking until it will set at a firm gel - quinces are high in pectin and gel easily). Many recipes also call for poaching them with spices and eating them that way. Though the sauce turns into a jelly if you're not careful. They are naturally white/cream-coloured inside, but turn bright red with extended cooking.