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Why the N --need help for grammar

EoMy, 2012 m. gegužė 22 d.

Žinutės: 15

Kalba: English

EoMy (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 22 d. 15:52:09

Saluton,

I don't understand why this sentence carries an N as accusative but the adjective is not.

La lago estas tri metrojn profunda.

Can someone help to explain. I am much confused.

Thanks

Hyperboreus (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 22 d. 15:59:13

Forigite

fajrkapo (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 22 d. 16:03:17

EoMy:La lago estas tri metrojn profunda
as you say:
la lago estas profunda ,(how much?) ---kun//de/je---- tri metro-j,
But as you dont use any prepositions, you can substitute the preposition by -n, or use preposition, one between the two options:
la lago estas de tri metroj profunda, or
la lago estas tri metrojn profunda,
I hope it helps...

PD you could use too, la lago HAVAS tri metrojn da profundo-profundeco

Mustelvulpo (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 22 d. 20:56:53

The accusative ending can be used not just for measures of distance, but for measures of time as well: Mi restis tie dum tri tagoj= Mi restis tie tri tagojn. It helps make the language more concise. The accusative is one of the harder things to grasp when you begin the language- at times you don't use it where should and you use it when you shouldn't- but I promise you that within a short time it becomes clear and makes perfect sense.

RiotNrrd (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 01:44:25

I think it's actually potentially confusing for beginners to be told the -n is for measures of distance, or time, or of anything, really. While it's technically true, it really is being used in measures this way just as a specific application of a more general usage: the use of the accusative -n to replace a preposition.

That's all that's happening here. It's not so much that the accusative -n is being used for measurements, per se. It's just replacing prepositions that in these cases happen to be describing measurements.

The accusative -n can be used to replace any preposition, whether it's describing a measurement or not.

RiotNrrd (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 01:50:25

RiotNrrd:The accusative -n can be used to replace any preposition, whether it's describing a measurement or not.
Not that I necessarily think it should.

The replacement of prepositions by the accusative case has always struck me as somewhat inelegant, and potentially confusing. I much prefer using adverbs, which basically do the same thing without making you wonder how that intransitive verb got a direct object, look at that -n, that's really weird, oh wait, that's right, preposition, duh.

fajrkapo (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 02:00:45

Anyone knows if I could say, following the example of the lake?:

La lago estas trimetre profunda. Instead of la lago estas tri metrojn profunda.

RiotNrrd can you give an example of any preposition? thanks

Hyperboreus (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 02:11:36

Forigite

RiotNrrd (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 03:56:40

fajrkapo:Anyone knows if I could say, following the example of the lake?:

La lago estas trimetre profunda.
Well, I don't see any reason why not. Although, to be honest, it's not an area I claim any great experience with.

fajrkapo:RiotNrrd can you give an example of any preposition? thanks
I don't understand what you are requesting.

RiotNrrd (Rodyti profilį) 2012 m. gegužė 23 d. 04:11:23

Hyperboreus:As already explained by the others, measurements are expressed by the use of the n-ending. According to PMEG, adverbs are used to describe manner, time, place and quantity. Your sentence would be:

La lago estas tri metrojn profunda. = The lake is three meters deep.
while
La lago estas trimetre profunda. = The lake is threemeterly deep...
The last one, while terrible English, is perfectly fine Esperanto*. And, as you noted, adverbs denote quantity, and we're talking about quantity, so it works.

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* And, having spoken Esperanto for a while now, I do find myself wishing on occasion that those sorts of constructions WERE good English.

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