nicht gleich wie Sie

Maybe they're not by themselves French-derived, but French-similar, so we have the same problem with them as with French-derived words!

Is klar dass ick bin nickt de Germanischmeister

Vilinilo:In fact, there are alternatives for all those words. I think the ONLY word in Esperanto with ĥ that doesn't have an alternative is "ĉeĥo" (czech).

The alternative forms of eĥo and monaĥo are ekoo and of monako.

But there are some people who don't have any problem with ĥ, I think native speakers of Spanish and German must find it very easy.

i think that the Chinese can prononce the letter better。
mi pensas la Cxina popoloj povas prononci la litero pli bone。

ceigered:Is klar dass ick bin nickt de Germanischmeister

Klar doch/Sure! But you still have to pass the La Brass Banda test. If you will pass please tell me what they sing about.

qwertz:

ceigered:Is klar dass ick bin nickt de Germanischmeister

Klar doch/Sure! But you still have to pass the La Brass Banda test. If you will pass please tell me what they sing about.

I translate the first paragraph using my amazing German-language skills:

übern Bauernstadl hintre
geh I aufe auf die Felder
schau vo hint aus wia a Guadl
hob die Haar zam wie a Wuida

Super Jason Bauer hinders
Gegh and other of the Fielders (maybe a terrorist force in the show '24? ),
So what Aussie hint was a Gwaddle-hop?
Zam's hair as (it) would've (been).


(I'm guessing something like:
"Above the behind Farmer(stadl) go I over above the fields" and with "wia" = "wir", "hob" = "hab"?)

ned amoi i ois Weana vasteh des

(translation to English: not even I as a Viennese understand this)

darkweasel:Esperanto has many sounds that are difficult for somebody in the world. For example, I can't easily distinguish between z and s, or between ĵ and ŝ - so do I change all z/ĵ-words to s/ŝ-words?! No! Because that distinction IS in the language, so I have to get used to it.

Interesting. I know a Korean girl who can't pronounce the ĵ sound in French. She uses the z sound instead. It would seem that ŝ, ĵ, s and z are actually closer prononciation-wise than they are in my French-shaped perception of them.

darkweasel:So should English/French speakers do with ĥ. Ĥ is a great sound that's completely NOT worth changing or getting rid of.

Actually, in French the Ĥ sound is the only one available when pronouncing a (French) R preceded by the sounds /k f p s t/. For exemple, Fr{Cru, Français, Produit, Ça s'rait bien, Travailler} contain all the Ĥ sound. So we fear not the big, bad Ĥo!
To examplify this more strikingly, I'd like to refer you all to this song by Mell. She purposely put as many French, ĥ-sound words as possible in the lyrics: Mell - Les Mots Crus

As far as English speakers are concerned, well I'm guessing that at least the Scottish English speakers, with their Loch Ness, don't find this sound too difficult.

erinja:I think we should remove all French-derived words from Esperanto. That way, French people will no longer have to be confused about these words!

Haha! Anyway, I wouldn't say that they are confusing. Not to me anyway. But I agree with Frankouche that you still have to memorize them because of their tiny but still real differences. If look-alike-ness (what? I can't make up words just like in Esperanto?) to your native language was enough for a language to be easy to learn, then Italian, Spanish, Catalan, Occitan should all be very easy to me. They are not. I can express myself better in English than in these languages.

ceigered:

I translate the first paragraph using my amazing German-language skills:

übern Bauernstadl hintre
geh I aufe auf die Felder
schau vo hint aus wia a Guadl
hob die Haar zam wie a Wuida

Super Jason Bauer hinders
Gegh and other of the Fielders (maybe a terrorist force in the show

'24? ),
So what Aussie hint was a Gwaddle-hop?
Zam's hair as (it) would've (been).


(I'm guessing something like:
"Above the behind Farmer(stadl) go I over above the fields" and with

"wia" = "wir", "hob" = "hab"?)

darkweasel:ned amoi i ois Weana vasteh des

(translation to English: not even I as a Viennese understand this)

bauersbua lyrics. @youtube That's definitivly no german anymore!

Hej, hej ... I assume. But I'm not sure! The topic seems to be that "A farmer tried some socialising/dancing"

bavarian: übern Bauernstadl hintre
de: hinter der Scheune/ hinten raus aus der Scheune
en: leaving the (cow) barn to the back

bavarian: geh I aufe auf die Felder
de: gehe ich über die Felder
en: I walking accross the fields

bavarian: schau vo hint aus wia a Guadl
de: (Ich) sehe von hinten aus wie ein Bonbon
en: I'm look from the back like a (bonbon) sweet

bavarian: hob die Haar zam wie a Wuida
de: (und) habe die Haare zusammen wie ein Wilder
en: and I have the hair tighten like a savage

etc.

http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stadel
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Guadl

Wait.. So what language IS that song in?

ceigered:Wait.. So what language IS that song in?

The local sound of Übersee near the Chiemsee and part of the Traunstein district and part of Upper Bavaria. But it is definitly different from the Munich/Rosenheim sound.

It's called oberbairisch/upper bavarian

Ha, ha, I didn't know that or it is a wikipedia joke: "... It is named 'Upper Bavaria' because the land is higher above sea level, not according to the map..." Also Lower Bavaria excists.

bavarian dialects

But: "Amts- und Verkehrssprache ist Deutsch. Offical language is German" Em, "Hochdeutsch"

lyrics

Jetz steh I da,
en: Now I stand here
Mit de voglwuidn Haar
en: with "bird-wide" hair
Mitm Sakko vo meim Papa
en: with the sack coat of my dad,
Ja, de Fliang geht no ab
en: Yes, the flies will not beat loose,