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Can pronouns be turned into adverbs?

글쓴이: MiMalamasLaAnglan, 2018년 1월 25일

글: 9

언어: English

MiMalamasLaAnglan (프로필 보기) 2018년 1월 25일 오후 10:50:13

Why can't mie, vie, lie, ŝie, ĝie, nie, ilie, onie, sie, cie, etc. be used as a dative (or some other) case? For example: Mi donas aferon vie (I give you something). My understanding is that turning a noun into an adverb can be used as a dative case, so why not do the same with pronouns?

sergejm (프로필 보기) 2018년 1월 26일 오전 12:57:29

The dative is 'Mi donas al vi ...' ('I give (to) you ...' ). In English, you can omit 'to' in this case, but it is an English specific.
'Mi donas vie ...' means 'Mi donas kiel vi ...' ('I give as you ...')
The same is with nouns: 'Mi donas patre ...' means 'I give as father ...', but 'Mi donas hejme ...' means 'I give at home ...' etc.
Never dative!
Even in 'Mi iras hejmen' = 'I go (to) home' - 'to' is not dative here, but direction.

Metsis (프로필 보기) 2018년 1월 26일 오전 8:56:09

Se vi volas esti preciza, la kazo, kiu montras "movon en certan direkton", nomiĝas ilativo, sed en ĉi tiu okazo oni uzas en la angla prepocizian esprimon kaj E-o akuzativan esprimon de adverbo.

Ĉiukaze sergejm pravas. La adverboj esprimas "kiel maniere", do la adverbaj formoj de personaj pronomoj esprimas: mi donas vie = mi donas kiel vi ("I give as if I were you/in your way"). Teorie eblas, sed ne uzata en praktiko.

murakvo (프로필 보기) 2018년 12월 28일 오전 7:55:23

I believe you can, I've seen it a few times and I certainly think it's logical and easy to understand. It would then be:

mien / mion = to me
mie = like me, at me, in me (or whatever, based on context)
mio = mi

You can also use (and people do use) prepositions this way: "ale" instead of "al" etc.

amigueo (프로필 보기) 2018년 12월 28일 오전 11:28:33

1/ nur fantazio:
mir = al mi

2/ "mie" rilatas al "tiue" kaj "tiuje" kaj "kelkaje" kaj 'iuje"
eble, iujo = iuj

amigueo (프로필 보기) 2018년 12월 28일 오전 11:36:50

mio = mi (?)
do
mieco kaj miaeco
aŭ mioeco (?)

ni bezonas ordon pri prioritatoj, analogie al matematikaj simboloj, por eviti parentezojn aŭ parentezojon

kvalito de esti mi = mieco (?)
kvalito de esti mia = miaeco (?)

mi memoras: "unueco" kaj "unuaeco"
la facilo de -a produktas malfacilon de miaeco.
facilo kreas malfacilon, domaĝe.

MiMalamasLaAnglan (프로필 보기) 2018년 12월 31일 오후 4:52:01

I guess I was wrong to say "mie". I should have said "mien".

sergejm (프로필 보기) 2018년 12월 31일 오후 5:12:33

'mie' signifas 'kiel mi volas'.
'mio' signifas 'ego' (la sento de memestimo aŭ mem-graveco), 'alia mio' = 'alter ego' (en multaj nunaj lingvoj estas ĉi tiaj latinaj esprimoj)

Metsis (프로필 보기) 2019년 1월 2일 오전 8:57:13

Adverbs answer the question "how", like rapidly (rapide), gladly (gaje), in my way (miamaniere) etc. Suppose we form an adverb from a word with noun-character (see vortfarado), for instance domo → dome. What would that word mean? In a housy (?) way, house-wise? No, there is no general rule, that would permit any noun to be turned into an adverb. Every adjective-characteristic word can be turned into an adverb (see rapide and gaje above), but only some with noun-character (maniere). I would hesitate to turn pronouns into adverbs, since they would certainly not be clear immediately.

Just my...

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