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Can I say "Vin amas" in E-o?

จาก exaos, 20 ธันวาคม 2012

ข้อความ 17

ภาษา: English

exaos (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 07:44:31

In Italian, you can speak "Ti amo", where "Ti" means "you". In E-o, we say "Mi amas vin". Can I omit "mi" and just say "Vin amas"?

Fenris_kcf (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 08:30:08

I'm not capable of speaking Italian, but as far as i know, it conjugates for every person, so "amo" indicates, that it is first person/singular.
I would understand any Esperanto-sentence without a subject in the way, that i am the actor, so "vin amas" is totally clear to me.

BTW: I don't understand how this question fits in the English forum.

MoutOp (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 08:37:06

Yes, in Italian the personal pronoun isn't required. But, if it's used, it emphasizes the actant. If I say "Io amo ti", I don't say "I love you", but "Me, I love you". In Eo, as in French or English, the personal pronoun is required.

Chainy (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 08:37:07

Fenris_kcf:...so "vin amas" is totally clear to me.
It's very confusing to me. I'm wondering who or what 'amas'!

hebda999 (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 10:05:36

Chainy:
Fenris_kcf:...so "vin amas" is totally clear to me.
It's very confusing to me. I'm wondering who or what 'amas'!
Sometimes I must agree with Chainy. It is bad Esperanto.

tommjames (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 10:39:59

Fenris_kcf:I would understand any Esperanto-sentence without a subject in the way, that i am the actor
Are you sure? What about "Temas pri gramatiko" or "Baldaŭ pluvos" or "Estas bone"?

Anyway as to the question, "Vin amas" is bad Esperanto. There are only a very small number of sensubjektaj verbs in Esperanto and I wouldn't count "ami" among them.

myris (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 11:09:16

In Italian, as in Spanish, Portuguese ..., it's possible to say ti amo, te quiero ..without a personal pronoun for any person of the verb has a specific ending : am-o, am-i, a, iamo,ate, ano. When there is only one ending for every person, as in esperanto or Swedish, the pronoun is required: mi, vi, li...am-as; jag, du, hon...
älsk-ar.

Roberto12 (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 11:21:35

I remember a few years ago seeing a conlang that someone had made that was billed as the fictitious ancestor language of Esperanto. I can't seem to find it now, but one of the few things I remember was that the verbs conjugated according to person and number;

Mi estas = estam
Vi estas = estas
Ĝi estas = estat
Ni estas = estajm
Vi estas = estajs
Ili estas = estajt

Only in this hypothetical ancestor language would the phrase in the OP be valid, in which case of course it would be rendered as "vin amam".

myris (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 12:12:20

In Italian, as in Spanish, Portuguese ..., it's possible to say ti amo, te quiero ..without a personal pronoun for any person of the verb has a specific ending : am-o, am-i, a, iamo,ate, ano. When there is only one ending for every person, as in esperanto or Swedish, the pronoun is required: mi, vi, li...am-as; jag, du, hon...
älsk-ar.

exaos (แสดงโปรไฟล์) 20 ธันวาคม 2012, 12:38:50

Thanks, myris and Roberto12. You make this question clear. And thanks to all replies. Now, I know, though "vin amas" can be understood sometimes, it is bad E-o.

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